Author: Michelle Lesley

Servant of Christ, wife, mother, churchwoman, women's discipleship blogger, podcaster, and speaker.
Forgiveness, Mailbag

The Mailbag: Can unforgiveness cause you to you lose your salvation?

Michelle Lesley

Originally published August 19, 2019

Can unforgiveness cause me to lose my salvation?

Forgiving (or refusing to forgive) others as it relates to our salvation is such an important issue. I’m so glad you asked!

Let’s break this question down a bit.

Can you lose your salvation?

The first thing we need to tackle is whether or not someone whom Christ has genuinely saved can lose her salvation – for unforgiveness or any other reason. And the answer to that question is no.

Why? The short answer is that if God saves someone, and that person can subsequently “unsave” herself, that makes her more powerful than God, which, as we know, can’t happen. You can’t save yourself, and you can’t unsave yourself. Salvation is all of God.

You can’t save yourself, and you can’t unsave yourself. Salvation is all of God.

When God saves you, you are His new creation in Christ. You can’t “uncreate” your new spiritual life any more than you can “uncreate” your body, or a tree, or a planet. You can kill or do damage to those things, but you cannot reverse God’s creative process. To use another example, oh so relevant to today, God created you female. You can mutilate your body til kingdom come trying to appear male, but that will not change the fact that at your genetic level – the very essence of your being – you are female. And you can’t undo that because God created you that way, and you’re not more powerful than God. If you can’t even change God’s creation of your physical body, how in the world can you change God’s creation of your spiritual being?

The moment God saves you, He forgives all your sins, past, present, and future, and robes you in the righteousness of Christ.

In addition to the fact that you can’t uncreate the new creature God has created you to be, you need to remember that the moment God saves you, He forgives all your sins, past, present, and future, and robes you in the righteousness of Christ. That swear word you’re going to say next week? Already forgiven. That lie you’re going to tell five years from now? Already forgiven. And if you decide to commit the sin of refusing to forgive someone, that sin has already been forgiven too. (So since all our sins are already forgiven, we can just commit as much sin as we want and we don’t have to worry about it, right? Wrong.) We still need to confess those sins to God and be cleansed from them because they disrupt our fellowship with God, but in His accounting office, that sin debt has already been marked “paid in full”.

Furthermore, Jesus tells us plainly that if He’s got you, He’s got you:

My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me. I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all, and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand. I and the Father are one.”

No one. That includes you and your sin. The power of your sin is not greater than God’s power to forgive that sin.

The power of your sin is not greater than God’s power to forgive that sin.

They will never perish. To say that a person about which Jesus Himself has said, “I give them eternal life,” can lose her salvation is to call Jesus a liar. He says that person “will never perish.” End of story.

Still not convinced that someone whom Christ has genuinely saved can’t lose her salvation? Try these passages on for size.

Now the reason it can look to us like someone can lose her salvation comes from two places: experience and misunderstanding the Bible.

The reason it can look to us like someone can lose her salvation comes from two places: experience and misunderstanding the Bible.

Experience:
It’s happened plenty of times in the past, but in the last few weeks, we’ve seen two high profile evangelicals “walk away from the faith,”: Joshua Harris and Marty Sampson. Maybe you know someone personally – a friend, a loved one, even a pastor – who gave every appearance of being a Christian and then suddenly left Christianity, and the church, behind.

How does this compute when the Bible teaches that genuinely born again Christians cannot lose their salvation? Well, we need to remember something else the Bible teaches that’s very important:

Not everyone who claims to be a Christian actually is one.

Some people consciously know they’re not really saved and are just trying to pull the wool over the eyes of others. But many (my guess is “most” – these days there’s not a lot of social cachet in calling yourself a Christian) are deceived into believing they’re saved. Maybe they heard some sort of unbiblical gospel presentation and have put their faith in a decision they made in response. Maybe they just assume they’re saved because they’re good church-going people and their church doesn’t teach them otherwise. Who knows? It could be a lot of things. But we know for sure that there are many people who call themselves Christians and believe they are Christians who aren’t. Why? Because the Bible says so:

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’
Matthew 7:21-23

“Many will say”…False converts are common, not few and far between. And it’s not just your average Joe or Jane in the pew, either. People who “prophesy…cast out demons…do mighty works” under the auspices of Christianity? They’re pastors, elders, deacons, Bible study teachers, seminary professors, “Christian” authors, evangelical celebrities. And Christ does not know them, because they don’t know Him. They talk the talk, and might even look like they walk the walk, but they’ve never truly believed the biblical gospel, repented of their sin, and trusted the Jesus of Scripture to save them. First John 2:18-19 puts it this way:

Children, it is the last hour, and as you have heard that antichrist is coming, so now many antichrists have come. Therefore we know that it is the last hour. They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us.

People whom Jesus has genuinely saved may fall into sin for a season, but they do not fall away from the faith. Those who leave the faith were never part of it in the first place, despite appearances or their claims to the contrary. It might be difficult, but this is one of those occasions when we have to believe what Scripture says over what we can see.

Those who leave the faith were never part of it in the first place, despite appearances or their claims to the contrary.

Jesus also tells us in the parable of the sower that there will be be “rocky ground” folks who will appear to be Christians, but because they have no root, they “endure for a while, and when tribulation or persecution arises on account of the word, immediately they fall away.” Jesus follows up this parable with the parable of the wheat and tares which further drives home His point that there will be impostors in the visible church.

So even though we observe people who appear to be Christians “falling away from the faith,” through unforgiveness or any other sin, we know that what’s really happening is that a lost person got tired of pretending to be saved and went back to being a lost person. Second Peter 2:22 puts it this way:

What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”

If Christ has never fundamentally changed your spiritual nature from dog or pig into a new creature in Christ, you’re still a dog or a pig. And even if you manage to clean up on the outside you’ll eventually return to the vomit of being a dog and the mud of being a pig because that’s your nature.

Misunderstood Scripture
There are passages in the Bible that, when misunderstood, when taken out of their immediate context, or when taken out of the overall context of Scripture can seem to teach that a person can lose her salvation. But as we’ve seen, there are way too many rightly handled, in context passages of Scripture that refute that idea.

Can you lose your salvation by refusing to forgive someone?

You mentioned in your original question that you believe unforgiveness can cause someone to lose her salvation because, “It is so clear in so many ways in Scripture, even parables that Jesus told.” But, you did not mention any of the Scriptures you think teach this. My guess is that one of the Scriptures you’re thinking of is Matthew 6:14-15:

For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

In context, we can see that these two verses come at the end of the Lord’s Prayer. In verse 12, Jesus has just taught us to pray that God would “forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors,” and He’s giving us a little addendum on this in 14-15.

Remember, even though all our sins from birth to death were forgiven at the moment of our salvation, we still need to confess our sins in prayer and ask God to cleanse us from our wrongdoing to bring us back into right fellowship with Him. But if you’re willfully in the middle of committing the sin of unforgiveness against someone, you’re still actively sinning. You haven’t turned from that sin in order to be cleansed. You’re essentially rolling around in the mud and asking God to cleanse you while you have no intention of getting out of the mud. How is that supposed to work? It doesn’t make any sense. If you want to get cleaned up (“forgiven”), you have to get out of the mud (stop committing the sin of unforgiveness – “forgive”). Otherwise, you’re asking God to restore the fellowship you’re still actively damaging with your sin.

Another passage you might be thinking of is the parable of the unforgiving servant. The takeaway from this passage is not that God will rescind the salvation of Christians who commit the sin of unforgiveness. This passage doesn’t say that and we already know that idea conflicts with what Scripture teaches about the security of the Believer.

The takeaway from this passage is that God has forgiven us a sin debt that is incomprehensible. Knowing and having experienced that forgiveness, how could we not forgive some paltry little sin another human commits against us? First John 4:19 says, “We love because He first loved us,” and the way He loved us was to forgive us our sin. So we also forgive because He first forgave us. And if we can giddily and unrepentantly harbor unforgiveness in our hearts against someone else, we’d better start testing ourselves against Scripture to see if we’re really in the faith. Because that kind of unforgiveness is not the fruit of a redeemed life, it’s the fruit of someone who’s unsaved.

No, a genuinely regenerated Christian cannot lose her salvation by committing the sin of unforgiveness. But if she is genuinely regenerated, she will repent of that sin and forgive.

A genuinely regenerated Christian cannot lose her salvation by committing the sin of unforgiveness. But if she *is* genuinely regenerated, she will repent of that sin and forgive.

Additional Resources:

Walking Away from Faith? at A Word Fitly Spoken Podcast

The Mailbag: Must I reconcile with my abusive ex-husband?

Forgiving Like Kings and Servants

You Can’t Love Jesus with a Heart Full of Hate: 7 Reasons to Love and Forgive Your Enemies

Am I Really Saved? A 1 John Check Up

If you have a question about: a Bible passage, an aspect of theology, a current issue in Christianity, or how to biblically handle a family, life, or church situation, comment below (I’ll hold all questions in queue {unpublished} for a future edition of The Mailbag) or send me an e-mail or private message. If your question is chosen for publication, your anonymity will be protected.

Discernment Bible Study

Choose What Is Right: A Study in Discernment- Lesson 7

Michelle Lesley

Previous Lessons: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6

Refuse to Heed the Shepherd and You’ll Have the Wool Pulled Over Your Eyes

Today’s Scripture passages are embedded in the body of the study. Please click the links in each question.

Questions to Consider

Throughout this study we will be looking at various passages of Scripture rather than working our way through a book of the Bible verse by verse. Because of that, we will need to be extra vigilant to rightly handle these passages in context. I will always attempt to provide the context you need for understanding these passages correctly, but if you need more clarity please feel free to read as much of the surrounding text as you need to – even the whole book, if necessary – in order to properly understand the passage presented.

1. We need a firm foundation. What is that firm foundation? First and Second Timothy and Titus comprise what are known as the “pastoral epistles”. They are God’s instructions, via Paul, to Timothy, Titus, and all other pastors about how to run the church. I often liken the pastoral epistles to a “policy and procedure manual” for the church.

Even in these three very brief epistles, God has a lot to say about sound and false doctrine, and sound and false teachers. Read these passages from the pastoral epistles (you may wish to read more of the surrounding verses for context). What is the foundation of a healthy church? How does a foundation of being intentional and purposeful to preach and teach sound doctrine protect a church against the infiltration of false doctrine and false teachers?

Meditate on Paul’s solemn charge to pastors in the 2 Timothy 4:1-2 passage. Explain exactly what he is saying in these verses. Would you liken this charge to a vow or “oath of office”? Why or why not? Put yourself in Timothy’s sandals. Do you feel the weightiness of this charge and responsibility? How so?

As Paul is preparing to leave the Ephesian church, he mentions two ways, in Acts 20:29-30, in which false teachers can infiltrate the church. What are those two ways? How does a solid foundation of sound doctrine help guard against false teachers coming into the church from the outside, and prevent those who are already church members from believing false doctrine and becoming false teachers inside the church?

2. Regarding discernment, why do we need the firm foundation of the preaching and teaching of sound doctrine? Examine these passages. (Compare the verse references to the passages from question 1. See the proximity and context?) Why, in the context of discernment, is the teaching and preaching of sound doctrine so crucial? What will happen to those who refuse to heed sound doctrine? Which adjectives does Paul use in the 1 Timothy passage to paint a picture of the deceitfulness of false teachers? How does Paul address the idea of people being deceived and departing from the faith in these passages – as a possibility or a certainty? (Hint: Look for the word “will”.)

3. How is this deception accomplished? Are these people who “depart from the faith” deceived solely by the false teachers, self-deceived, or both?

Study these passages. What do they tell us about a person’s role in her own deception? Who is taking the initiative in these two passages, the false teachers/prophets, or the people who want to follow them? In the Isaiah passage, before the people turn to the seers and prophets in verse 10, how does verse 9 describe them? What have they already turned from? In the 2 Timothy passage, before the people turn to false teachers (3b) and myths (4b), what have they already turned away from (3a, 4a)?

Compare 2 Timothy’s “they will accumulate for themselves” and “teachers to suit their own passions” (3b) with Isaiah’s 10-11. How did the people in Isaiah proactively pursue or accumulate false teachers? What were “their own passions” they wanted to suit? Are people who turn to false teachers hapless, powerless victims of those false teachers or willing participants in their own deception?

Again, what happens when you “refuse to heed the Shepherd” (Jesus, His Word, sound doctrine, etc.)? Think about the nature and definition of the word “deceived”. Do deceived people know they’re deceived?

But if every teacher out there only taught sound doctrine, would self-deceived people be able to accumulate teachers to themselves to suit their own passions? It’s kind of a symbiotic relationship, isn’t it?

Study these passages. What do all of these passages say false teachers disguise themselves as? Make a list of the words and phrases from each passage that led you to your answer:

  • 2 Corinthians 11:
  • Galatians 2:
  • 2 Peter 2:
  • Titus 1:

Think about some of the false teachers you’re aware of (or check here if you need a little help). Do any of them go by the title “False Teacher”? Introduce themselves as false teachers? Write books and give interviews as experts in the field of false teaching? What titles do they go by? What do they want to be known as?

In the 2 Corinthians passage, what does Paul say the false apostles claim? (12) Are their claims true? (13) What three words in verse 13 indicate that these men are not honest? Compare verses 14-15 with Jesus addressing the Pharisees (the false teachers of His day) in John 8:42-47. Who is the spiritual “father” of these false teachers in both passages? Who do they actually serve? Are they actually Christians, as they claim to be? What does Paul mean, “Their end will correspond to their deeds.”(15)? What will their end be? (Hint- use your cross references)

Why do you think some professing Christians believe even the most egregious false teachers are actually Christians despite what these passages teach to the contrary? Is it fair to say they are believing the false teacher’s word over God’s Word?

Compare the 2 Corinthians passage and the John 8 passage above with Genesis 3:1-7. What similarities do you see when it comes to the descriptions of Satan’s character and methods?

Homework

Read 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus. Carefully examine each passage that deals with either the need to preach and teach sound doctrine or the need to rebuke and refute false teachers or false doctrine. Why is the proactive, purposeful, and intentional teaching of sound doctrine vital to the health of the church? How does sound doctrine itself refute false doctrine? Why is it imperative to rebuke and remove unrepentant false teachers from the church?

A common argument against the public rebuke and refutation of false teachers is that, “You shouldn’t warn against them, you should just pray for them.” (see #10 here). How would you answer that argument with the passages you examined in 1 & 2 Timothy and Titus?

You may wish to refer to parts of my studies on the pastoral epistles as you study:

1 & 2 Timothy: The Structure and Spirit of the Church

Titus: God’s Order of Service

Suggested Memory Verse

Discernment

Throwback Thursday ~ Discernment Hysteria and the God Who Wins

Michelle Lesley

Originally published April 8, 2016

There are a lot of different facets to Christianity. There’s worship. Fellowship with other Christians. Studying God’s Word alone, with our families, and with the local church. Evangelism. Serving at church. Teaching. Discipling other believers. Prayer. All of these things, and others, are vital to a healthy, growing relationship with Christ.

But things can get out of whack if we focus too much on any one of these areas to the neglect of others. Spend too much time in prayer, and you could overlook serving others. Focus on evangelism too much, and your Bible study time might suffer. It can be tricky, but it’s important that we keep a good balance in our walk with the Lord.

If you’re like me you probably have one or two areas that you’re tempted to go overboard in. My temptation is studying, particularly in the area of discernment- false doctrine and false teachers. It’s a fascinating topic, and people educated in the field of discernment and doctrine are desperately needed in the church today.

But if you spend a lot of time studying discernment –and many do- it can get pretty discouraging pretty quickly. You begin to realize just how pervasive false doctrine is and how many false teachers there are. It’s in your church, at your child’s Christian school, on your Christian radio and TV stations, in your Christian bookstore. It’s everywhere. And it’s not just the home grown heretics who spring from the soil of already apostate “churches.” We’ve also got men and women who were once trustworthy teachers and preachers of God’s Word turning traitor and joining the forces of evil at an alarming rate. They just keep coming and coming, always more and more. It’s starting to feel like Invasion of “The Body” Snatchers.

False teachers just keep coming and coming. It’s starting to feel like Invasion of “The Body” Snatchers.

I hear often from women approaching panic and frenzy over the state of the church. And I get that, because I regularly feel the same way. But for all of us, there are some great reasons to take a step back when we get overwhelmed. To breathe, to relax, and to rejoice in some good news in the midst of the heresy hurricane.

There are some great reasons to take a step back when we get overwhelmed. To breathe, to relax, and to rejoice in some good news in the midst of the heresy hurricane.

God is both sovereign and just.

And praise His name for that. Nothing, and I mean nothing, escapes His notice. He sees everything- every thought, every action. There is going to come a day of reckoning for the enemies of God. They will get exactly what they deserve, and God will be good for punishing them. When it’s all said and done, nobody’s getting away with anything, and nothing is going to slip through the cracks.

And no creature is hidden from his sight, but all are naked and exposed to the eyes of him to whom we must give account.
Hebrews 4:13

It is God’s job to preserve the church, not ours.

Thousands of years. Extreme idolatry and blasphemy. War. Exile. And yet God preserved a remnant of His people throughout the Old Testament. He preserved the church through its infancy of persecution and heresy. And He will continue to preserve His church today. Should we fight false doctrine the best we can? Yes. Will some local churches fold and apostasize? Yes. But, saving the church is way too big a job for us. Ultimately, the burden of preserving the Bride is on the Bridegroom.

Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.
Ephesians 5:25b-27

God’s Word isn’t changing.

It doesn’t matter how loudly people scream that this sin or that sin is OK. It doesn’t matter how many people teach the most unbiblical false doctrine or how widespread its acceptance is. God’s Word is God’s Word. And God’s Word changes for no man. The Bible – not anyone’s opinion or the general consensus of sinful humans – is the standard God has issued and the rod of judgment He will wield. God’s Word isn’t going anywhere.

for
“All flesh is like grass
    and all its glory like the flower of grass.
The grass withers,
    and the flower falls,
but the word of the Lord remains forever.”
1 Peter 1:24-25

It doesn’t matter how many people teach the most unbiblical false doctrine or how widespread its acceptance is. God’s Word is God’s Word. And God’s Word changes for no man.

The gospel still has the power to save.

God is mightier to save than any false teacher is to deceive. Get out there and keep faithfully scattering that gospel seed and proclaiming God’s truth. A lot of people will reject it – just like they did when Jesus preached it – but some will listen and be saved. They’re worth it.

Behold, the Lord’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, or his ear dull, that it cannot hear;
Isaiah 59:1

God is mightier to save than any false teacher is to deceive.

Heaven awaits.

Look around. This is all just temporary. In Heaven, there is no false doctrine. There are no false teachers. There will be no more contending for the faith. We will all finally be able to worship Christ in the splendor of His holiness with out any hint of error impeding us or infiltrating the Body.

Then I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and the sea was no more. And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling place of God is with man. He will dwell with them, and they will be his people, and God himself will be with them as their God.
Revelation 21:1-3

Be encouraged my sisters, and don’t grow weary in well doing. Because God is mighty. He is still on His throne. He is still saving souls.

And hear me, and cling to this as you walk through this evil world: God wins.

Let that sink in and drive you to rejoice and worship. The devil may do his worst in the world, but God wins.

he wins

Cling to this as you walk through this evil world: God wins. Let that sink in and drive you to rejoice and worship. The devil may do his worst in the world, but GOD WINS.

Mailbag, Parenting

The Mailbag: Potpourri (Rescinding a recommendation… Women at the Last Supper… Consistent discipline)

Michelle Lesley

Welcome to another “potpourri” edition of The Mailbag, where I give short(er) answers to several questions rather than a long answer to one question.

I like to take the opportunity in these potpourri editions to let new readers know about my comments/e-mail/messages policy. I’m not able to respond individually to most e-mails and messages, so here are some helpful hints for getting your questions answered more quickly. Remember, the search bar (at the very bottom of each page) can be a helpful tool!

Or maybe I answered your question already? Check out my article The Mailbag: Top 10 FAQs to see if your question has been answered and to get some helpful resources.

Our women’s ministry team recently asked all of us Bible study teachers to promote the study they have chosen, and I personally recommended it to the women in my class. I told them “I don’t know anything about the author and haven’t read the study, but I trust the women’s ministry team and recommend you participate.” That afternoon I began researching her and discovered she was a woman pastor. I immediately contacted the women’s coordinator and shared my concerns.

I feel TERRIBLE that I have recommended a woman whose life choices make her a stumbling block to the gals I dearly love and have taught for years. My first instinct is to send my students only an email rescinding my recommendation and warning them that the author routinely preaches in her local church. I am torn between protecting them from a very beguiling threat and the implications a warning has for exposing the women’s ministry team. LESSON LEARNED for future recommendations, but for now, what is my Biblical obligation/priority?

That’s a difficult spot to be in. I’ve been there myself, having passed along a recommendation from someone I thought was discerning and trustworthy, only to find out later that she was not.

Here’s what I would suggest:

  • If you haven’t already, get alone with the Lord in prayer and repent of your carelessness. There is grace, mercy, and forgiveness awaiting you.

  • Write out a carefully, kindly, and wisely worded email to your class apologizing for your carelessness and explaining why you need to rescind your recommendation. Support everything you say with Scripture. (If you think it would be helpful, you may wish to include a link to this article of mine.) Don’t hit “send” yet.

  • Talk to your pastor before you do anything else. Explain the situation, plead with him to cancel the study, tell him (don’t ask him) your conscience demands that you send an email to your class rescinding your recommendation of the study, and offer to show it to him if he’d like to see it.

  • I pray your pastor will cancel the study. I really do. That will take the pressure off of you. You will still need to apologize to your class and explain why you agree with the pastor’s decision to cancel the study. Unfortunately, in situations like this, the pastor almost always backs up the study and the women’s director, not the discerning Christian who comes to him with concerns.

  • If your pastor affirms the study and the women’s ministry leader, express your disappointment calmly and politely, and reiterate that you must still send the email. Go to the women’s ministry leader, and as a gesture of courtesy, explain that you’ll be sending an email to your class rescinding your recommendation. Then, send the email.

  • Immediately begin looking for a new, doctrinally sound church. Women who are “pastors” and/or preach to men are false teachers. They preach with their behavior, “I don’t like this command of Scripture, so I’m not going to obey it. If there’s a command of Scripture you don’t like, you don’t have to obey it either.”. If your pastor is so doctrinally ignorant or unsound that he affirms this sin and false teaching, you don’t need to be sitting under his teaching and leadership.

What are the Scripture verses that back up the teachings that women were at the last supper? I know that this is something I’ve heard before, yet now my grandson is asking me about it because that’s what he learned in school.

There aren’t any. In fact, I’ve never heard anyone claim that any person – man or woman – other than Jesus and the twelve disciples were in attendance at the Last Supper.

  • The Matthew account says Jesus “reclined at table with the twelve.”
  • The Mark account says Jesus “came with the twelve. And as they were reclining at table and eating…”
  • The Luke account says Jesus “reclined at table, and the apostles with him.”
  • The John account focuses more on Jesus’ teaching at and after the supper than the actual supper itself, but even John says, “During supper” (v.2) Jesus “began to wash the disciples’ feet…” (v.5)

When you consider all four of the gospel accounts together, there is absolutely no argument to be made that anyone was present at the Last Supper besides Jesus and the twelve. There were no women among the twelve. There were no women apostles. Therefore, no women were at the Last Supper.

I’m guessing what happened is that somebody – perhaps Catholicism, in order to elevate Mary, or perhaps feminists, in order to make Jesus seem like an egalitarian – took a mention of “disciples” (without “the twelve” in front of it) from one of these passages and decided that could mean any follower of Jesus he or she wanted it to mean (most likely Mary, the mother of Jesus, or Mary Magdalene).

If your grandson is asking questions like this, take him to Scripture and teach him how to be a good Berean. Show him how to look up the passages in question and compare what he’s being taught to what the Bible actually says.

And if you have a relationship with his parents that allows you to express your concerns about what he’s being taught at school, express them (kindly, yet seriously, taking care not to be overbearing). I shudder to think about all the unbiblical things that school is indoctrinating your grandson with that he’s not asking you about.

I am a Christian mom, and I rarely accept back talk from my son. I always call it out, and usually give him some kind of discipline, but it doesn’t seem to improve things. Is there a secret formula?😃

That’s something a lot of moms deal with, and I know it’s got to be frustrating. Good for you for looking for ways to make your discipline more effective!

If what you’re doing isn’t working, your discipline either isn’t severe enough or isn’t consistent enough, or both. Discipline has to hurt in order to be effective.

A good example of the importance of consistency is an experiment I learned about when I was a psychology major back in the Stone Age. We were studying conditioning (training a subject in a behavior), and a lot of the studies we looked at had to do with training rats to push a lever for a pellet of food. Some rats got a pellet every time they pushed the lever. Some never got a pellet. Some got a pellet sometimes. Those were the rats who pushed the lever the most because they never knew when they would be rewarded with food or “punished” with none.

It’s the same with inconsistent discipline. You’re actually increasing the undesired behavior by being inconsistent because your child never knows whether that bad behavior is going to be rewarded, ignored, or punished. This is also part of what Ephesians 6:4 is talking about when it says not to exasperate your children.

Especially with boys, Dad needs to be involved. Your son needs to know that if he doesn’t respond to your discipline, Dad is going to step in and take over. The two of you should sit down, talk this through, and put a plan in place for how to work this out in various situations.

Also helpful would be to find a couple in your church whose children are well behaved and respectful and ask them to disciple you and your husband in this area.

Get those things going, and you’ll see improvement.

If you have a question about: a Bible passage, an aspect of theology, a current issue in Christianity, or how to biblically handle a family, life, or church situation, comment below (I’ll hold all questions in queue {unpublished} for a future edition of The Mailbag) or send me an e-mail or private message. If your question is chosen for publication, your anonymity will be protected.

Discernment

Throwback Thursday ~ Amputating Discernment Ministry from the Body of Christ

Michelle Lesley

Originally published February 2, 2018

“There’s no place for Christian blogs and podcasts. Preaching, teaching, and encouragement should only be done by pastors and teachers in the local church.”

“Open air preaching ministry needs to go the way of the dinosaur.”

“Pro-life ministry organizations just cause too much strife. Lost people are going to reject the gospel because of them.”

“The Bible nowhere mentions Christian legal defense organizations.”

You’ve probably never heard someone give one of these statements as a reason for doing away with podcasts or street preaching or the ADF, but these days it seems like everybody – including doctrinally sound, discerning Christians – is screaming, “Off with its head!” about parachurch discernment ministries for these supposed reasons, and others. It’s become the bandwagon du jour. The popular whipping boy for Christian social media. The here-today-gone-tomorrow zeitgeist of online evangelicalism.

Among those who wish to amputate discernment ministry from the Body are good, solid, loving, godly brothers and sisters in Christ. I just wish they realized that there are many of us on this side of the discernment fence who are also good, solid, loving, godly brothers and sisters in Christ.

Among those who wish to amputate discernment ministry from the Body are good, solid Believers. I just wish they realized that there are many of us on this side of the discernment fence who are *also* good, solid Believers.

It is a sad irony that the genuinely good guys who are clamoring for the death of discernment ministry are, in some cases themselves doing the very things they accuse discernment ministries of doing. While they may give a brief hat tip to “some discernment ministries aren’t so bad”, in calling for the disbanding of discernment ministry across the board, they effectively lump everyone who does any sort of discernment work – regardless of how infrequently or how biblically it’s done – into the same category as those who indiscriminately lob a constant barrage of truth-bending, vitriolic grenades at everyone from the rankest heretic to the reputable, doctrinally sound brother who has a slightly different take on their eschatological view. And in the same way it wouldn’t be fair to throw these brothers and sisters who speak from biblical love and concern for the church into the same bin as “Christians” who scream like banshees about discernment ministry because they just want to worship their idols in peace without their consciences being pricked, it’s not fair to unilaterally declare that discernment ministry should be banned, either.

Rebuke those doing discernment work whose character, behavior, and handling of Scripture is so egregious it disqualifies them from any ministry whatsoever (and, unfortunately, they do exist) but encourage those who do discernment ministry right.

Just like you would with any other ministry.

Rebuke those doing discernment work whose egregious character, behavior, and handling of Scripture disqualifies them from ministry, but encourage those who do discernment ministry right. Just like you would with any other ministry.

Because if there were ever a dire need for discernment ministry done right and biblically, it’s now. Banishing the discerning altogether would be neither biblical nor beneficial to the Body.

Discernment: A Major Theme of the New Testament

The Old Testament is rife with idolatry, syncretism, and false prophets. Every book of the New Testament except Philemon deals in some way with false doctrine or false teachers and the importance of keeping them out of the church and away from Christians. It is a major issue throughout the Bible, but particularly in New Testament theology and ecclesiology. Jesus dealt with it. Paul dealt with it. So did Peter, Jude, John, and other New Testament figures.  Part of the reason the 21st century church is so steeped in false doctrine and enamored with false teachers now is that we have been brushing discernment aside for so long instead of bringing it front and center like the Bible does. If the Holy Spirit – the author of Scripture – considers discernment to be so vital, shouldn’t we?

If the Holy Spirit – the author of Scripture – considers discernment to be so vital, shouldn’t we?

Amputating Body Parts

Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit; and there are varieties of service, but the same Lord; and there are varieties of activities, but it is the same God who empowers them all in everyone. To each is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good. For to one is given through the Spirit…the ability to distinguish between spirits…All these are empowered by one and the same Spirit, who apportions to each one individually as he wills…But as it is, God arranged the members in the body, each one of them, as he chose. If all were a single member, where would the body be? As it is, there are many parts, yet one body. The eye cannot say to the hand, “I have no need of you,” nor again the head to the feet, “I have no need of you.”
1 Corinthians 12:4-8a, 10b, 11, 18-21 (emphasis mine)

Discernment (distinguishing spirits) is just as ontologically valid a spiritual gift – a manifestation of the Holy Spirit – as any of the others listed in 1 Corinthians 12. It is a biblically legitimate gift, service, and activity given for the common good of the church and empowered by the same Spirit, Lord, and God who gives and empowers the spiritual gifts of those who would do away with discernment ministry. Spiritual gifts are given by God and arranged in the Body as He sees fit. It is not for one individual body part to say to another, “I have no need of you.” Selah.

Discernment is a biblically legitimate gift given for the common good of the church and empowered by the same Spirit who gives and empowers the spiritual gifts of those who would do away with discernment ministry.

Check Your Privilege

If you’re a discerning person who goes to a discerning church, has a discerning pastor and elders, and hangs out with discerning friends maybe you don’t see that there’s much of a need for discernment ministry.

And if you lived in Hawaii, you wouldn’t see much of a need for snow shovels, either.

But if you lived in Alaska, you would.

We each exist in our own little bubble of personal experience. And if your bubble is one where pretty much everybody is discerning, make sure you thank God profusely for that every day, because you are extremely blessed. You’re also an extremely rare anomaly, because the vast majority of the rest of Christianity has no clue what that’s like. The 99 per cent-ers live in a bubble that looks like the shelves of your local Christian retailer – some good stuff (if you know where to look) and a whole lot of skubalon. And most of them don’t know the difference because they’ve never been taught. Don’t assume your experience is the norm for everyone.

Maybe you don’t see that there’s much of a need for discernment ministry. And if you lived in Hawaii, you wouldn’t see much of a need for snow shovels, either. But if you lived in Alaska, you would.

Of Course Pastors Should Be Leading the Way

One of the most common arguments I hear against discernment ministry is that it’s the job of the pastor, not discernment ministries, to teach discernment. And with that statement, I could not more heartily agree! Discernment work is half of a pastor’s job description:

He must hold firm to the trustworthy word as taught, so that he may be able to give instruction in sound doctrine and also to rebuke those who contradict it.
Titus 1:9 (emphasis mine)

So let me ask you 99 per cent-ers: when was the last time you heard a pastor rebuke someone who contradicts sound doctrine? Or call a false teacher by name? Or teach about a currently popular false doctrine and warn against it? I am honored to know several pastors who aren’t afraid to faithfully perform this part of their job, and God bless them for it. We need far more pastors like them. Yes, pastors should be spearheading the work of discernment in their local churches. But by and large, they’re not. And the Bible doesn’t say that only pastors have the gift and responsibility of discernment. It is insanity to tell ready, able, and willing laymen with garden hoses to stand down and watch a building burn to the ground while they wait…and wait…and wait…for the professional firemen who may never show up.

Yes, pastors should be spearheading the work of discernment in their local churches. But by and large, they’re not.

But Lost People Will Reject the Gospel!

Lost people already reject the gospel. That’s why they’re lost. They don’t get any lost-er by seeing a discernment ministry critique a false teacher. In fact, I’ve known of lost people who have expressed their thanks to discernment ministries for denouncing the blasphemies of false teachers. Even in their spiritually blind state many unbelievers know a wolf when they see one. Sometimes – to our shame – even better than those who call themselves Christians. When someone rejects the gospel, it is no more the fault of a discernment ministry than it is the fault of a pro-life ministry, a ministry that disciples newly saved homosexuals, or any other type of biblical ministry. God is sovereign in salvation. He will save who He means to save, and no mere mortal is going to prevent Him from doing so.

When someone rejects the gospel, it is no more the fault of a discernment ministry than it is the fault of a pro-life ministry, a ministry that disciples newly saved homosexuals, or any other type of biblical ministry.

Your Comfort Versus Their Souls

Whatever it is that bothers you about discernment ministries, is your state of botheration as important as the spiritual condition of the person that discernment ministry is reaching? Maybe you’re worried about those lost people out there who might reject the gospel because of discernment ministry conflict. Are you just as concerned about the lady in the pew next to you at church who’s every bit as lost as those people “out there” because she listens to false teachers who preach a false gospel that’s made her a false convert? What if a discernment ministry could help her understand the truth of the gospel? It’s happened. I’ve heard many stories of false converts Providentially “stumbling upon” a discernment ministry, hearing the unadulterated gospel for the first time, and getting saved.

What about the Christian woman who spends her quiet time in tears every day because she’s been falsely taught that God will talk to her if she just listens hard enough and has enough faith, and she’s in despair because she’s not hearing from God? What if a discernment ministry could set her free from that burden by teaching her what the Bible really says and steering her away from those who have deceived her? It’s happened. I know it has, because something similar happened to me. Is your annoyance at discernment ministries more important than her spiritual health?

Whatever it is that bothers you about discernment ministries, is your state of botheration as important as the spiritual condition of the person that discernment ministry is reaching?

There is absolutely a place – a good, God-ordained, nobody-puts-Baby-in-a-corner place – for discernment ministry in the Body of Christ. Inside the church, online, in parachurch ministry, from pastors, elders, and laymen alike. Yes, those who abuse their position of ministry – in any ministry – should be rebuked and removed. But we don’t do away with entire spiritual gifts and areas of ministry because of a few bad apples. Instead of amputating, maybe we should be excising gangrenous tissue instead. Otherwise we’ll just be shooting ourselves – the Body – in the foot.

There is absolutely a place – a good, God-ordained, nobody-puts-Baby-in-a-corner place – for discernment ministry in the Body of Christ.