Tag: Revival

Discernment

Asbury, Revival, and Discernment

Michelle Lesley

Have you been hearing about this “Asbury Revival” thing lately, and wondering what it is? Is it a “real” revival? Is it biblical? Are people getting saved? These are just a few of the questions Christians have been asking as video, eyewitness accounts, and, undoubtedly, a good deal of speculation have made their way out of Kentucky to other parts of the country.

I would encourage you to examine the resources below and compare everything to rightly handled, in context Scripture. This is a way of testing the spirits as Scripture commands us, rather than simply believing every spirit that comes along.

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, for many false prophets have gone out into the world.

1 John 4:1

To help you practice your discernment, here (and throughout this article) are some questions to keep in mind as you read about and watch the “Asbury revival”:

đŸ”„Where does the Bible say that, in context, and rightly handled? Does the Bible really say that?

đŸ”„Is what I’m reading objective, rightly handled, in context Scripture, or someone’s subjective personal experiences, opinions, feelings, or preferences? Which am I hearing more of?

đŸ”„Could what I’m reading about have been replicated by a non-Christian person, event, or experience?

đŸ”„Who, or what, is my attention being drawn to – Jesus and His written Word, or people, opinions, feelings, and experiences?

đŸ”„A good, biblical approach to evaluating events like this, initially, is to “wait and see” what will transpire. We don’t want to make snap, uninformed judgments, but when there’s the possibility that spiritual damage could be done, at what point have we waited long enough and seen enough evidence that it is time to stop waiting and start warning?

What’s this all about?

“The 2023 Asbury Revival is an ongoing Christian revival at Asbury University in Wilmore, Kentucky. The event was prompted after students spontaneously stayed in Hughes Auditorium following a regularly scheduled chapel service on 8 Feb. 2023. News of the phenomena was quickly spread on social media and in Christian online publications. The revival has been compared to similar revivals at Asbury, notably one that occurred in 1970, which had far-reaching consequences in Methodism, US culture, and in the growth of the Jesus movement. The revival is noted for its use of social media, as the participants are mainly members of Generation Z.” 2023 Asbury Revival, Wikipedia

(Normally, I would not use Wikipedia as a resource, but after sifting through a dozen or so news stories for one that wasn’t slanted, didn’t drown the reader in tons of superfluous information, and simply presented the basic facts, unbelievably, Wikipedia is what I was left with. There are a few more details and a decent timeline of events at the link above.)

Entering week three, Asbury President Kevin Brown issued an announcement that the event will end on Wednesday, February 22. Asbury revival in Kentucky will end after two weeks of non-stop services, worship, Lexington Herald Leader

Theological Foundation, Background, and Context

đŸ”„Are all of Asbury’s doctrines and practices biblical? If not, which ones, and why?

đŸ”„Consider the following passage as you learn about Asbury’s doctrine and practices. Which parts of what you will read below are “tree,” and which parts are “fruit”? According to Scripture, does Asbury seem to be a healthy tree that will bear good fruit, or a diseased tree that will bear bad fruit?

You will recognize them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? So, every healthy tree bears good fruit, but the diseased tree bears bad fruit. A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, nor can a diseased tree bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will recognize them by their fruits.

“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’ Matthew 7:16-23

Asbury University has “its roots in the American Methodist and holiness tradition.” Here is their theological foundation as explained by Asbury University: Wesleyan-Holiness Theology

Briefer and more contemporary: Who are the Wesleyans, and what are the beliefs of the Wesleyan Church?

Though Asbury University retains many biblical standards on paper, genearally speaking, Wesleyans are Arminian, egalitarian rather than complementarian, pro-abortion, pro-homosexuality, and social justice oriented. They tend toward theological “progressivism” – the liberal end of the theological spectrum rather than the conservative end.

And, indeed, there are openly homosexual students at Asbury, and they have been helping lead this event. From an Asbury student:

And here is “Pastor” Laurel Bunker, who is scheduled to preach at chapel on March 20, 2023 – just one of the numerous women they regularly have preach.

Asbury University also has a history of recurring spiritual events which they have dubbed “revivals” and attribute to the Holy Spirit. From the Asbury University website:

Notice anything about the dates of these events? They all occurred near the time of the Collegiate Day of Prayer, which is always the last Thursday of February. This has raised questions as to whether or not these events may have been at least somewhat contrived or encouraged. Coincidentally or not, Asbury University is hosting the 200th anniversary simulcast for the Collegiate Day of Prayer on Thursday, February 23 – the day after the current “revival” is scheduled to end.

Content of the Meetings

đŸ”„What does the Bible say about the way we are to worship? How does the content of the Asbury meetings measure up against Scripture’s commands and instructions for biblical worship?

What’s being called the “Asbury revival” started after a regular weekly chapel service. This is the message that was preached during that chapel service that apparently got things going.

Many people have said that the gospel was preached during this sermon. Many others have said the gospel appeared nowhere in this sermon.

This is the gospel:

You are a sinner. You were born in sin and rebellion against the holy God of the universe, and you’ve also willfully chosen to break His law. You’ve lied. You’ve wanted and taken things that didn’t belong to you, which is coveting and stealing. You’ve lusted after someone, which Jesus said is committing adultery in your heart. You’ve been sinfully angry, which Jesus says is committing murder in your heart. You’ve dishonored your parents. And that’s only 6 of the 10 Commandments.

James 2:10 says, “For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become guilty of all of it.” So you’re guilty of breaking all of God’s law.

When you break the law, justice must be meted out. And the just punishment for rebellion against God is an eternity in Hell, which all of us richly deserve. And you can take that eternal death sentence for your sin, and serve it yourself if you want to, but God, who is rich in mercy, has provided another way out. A better way out. He sent His son, Jesus, to earth to live a perfect sinless life so He could take your death penalty for you. And that’s just what He did on the cross. He died in your place. He took the punishment for your sin. And then he rose bodily from the grave on the third day afterward.

If you want to be right with God, have your sins forgiven, and stand clean before Him now and when you die, confess your sin and rebellion against Him. Sorrowfully turn your heart and life away from sin and toward Him, believing that Jesus’ death, burial, and resurrection paid the penalty for your sin, and you ask Him to save you. And He will.

(For a more extensive version of the gospel with more Scripture references click the What Must I Do to Be Saved? tab in the blue menu bar at the top of this page.)

đŸ”„Was the gospel preached during this message? Did you hear about sin, repentance, God’s law, Christ’s life, death, burial, and resurrection for your sin, and God’s grace, mercy, and forgiveness? Can people get genuinely saved without hearing the full biblical gospel?

While many people have stood and spoken in front of those assembled, there have been conflicting reports about whether or not any further sermons have been preached.

Not all public speaking, even in a Christian or church setting, is preaching. To preach is to point the congregation to Christ and His written Word by taking a passage of Scripture and teaching, exegeting, expositing, and proclaiming it. Rightly handled Scripture is the substance around which a sermon revolves. Other forms of Christian speaking – such as personal testimonies, public prayer, words of encouragement, and merely reading or alluding to Scripture – are valid and appropriate at times, but they are not the same thing as preaching a sermon.

Below is the livestream of the Asbury meeting.

đŸ”„Which types of speaking do you see and hear? Preaching? Teaching Scripture? Personal testimonies? Is the speaker teaching and explaining Scripture, speaking about personal thoughts and experiences, speaking about the experience of the “revival” itself? Do you see more singing and prayer or more preaching?

đŸ”„Consider this passage as you listen to the speakers in the livestream:

For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” How then will they call on him in whom they have not believed? And how are they to believe in him of whom they have never heard? And how are they to hear without someone preaching? And how are they to preach unless they are sent? As it is written, “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the good news!” But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah says, “Lord, who has believed what he has heard from us?” So faith comes from hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ. Romans 10:13-17

đŸ”„Could someone hear the full gospel and get saved through what any of the speakers are saying? Why or why not?

There have been a number of reports that the nearly perpetual music during the meetings has largely been songs from Bethel, Hillsong, and Elevation. What do you observe in the livestream?

đŸ”„Have all of the songs’ lyrics been doctrinally sound according to Scripture? Is God pleased when we use music from heretical sources to worship Him even if the lyrics of a particular song don’t conflict with Scripture?

One of the concerns early on in the meetings was that rank heretics of the worst order such as Todd Bentley, Rodney Howard Browne, Tasha Cobbs, and Greg Locke were attracted to and enjoyed attending the Asbury meetings. Some speculated that they attended in order to gain some sort of power, take over the meetings, or garner attention for themselves.

đŸ”„Would such demonically controlled people have shown up at a “revival” meeting at any doctrinally sound church you can think of where the gospel was being preached and Scripture was being rightly handled? If they had, what impact should that have had on them, spiritually?

False teacher Todd Bentley posts he is ‘booked to spend several days’ at ‘Asbury revival’ — university says he was not invited to speak

OP Continued: “…This happens when people get hungry for more of God. Many will refer to this as a sovereign move of God, however God sovereignly moved 2000 years ago on the day of Pentecost, and he has never stopped. He is still moving today. Can’t wait to hear all the critics, the controllers or better yet the opportunists who would love to co-opt what God does. Let this shut down the whole university! Let the fire continue to fall & spread! #Revival #HolySpirit #Awakening @AsburyUniv

In addition to the worst of the worst evangelical heretics, several in Catholic leadership have attended the meetings and spoken glowingly about them. (Catholicism is not Christianity. Those who hold to Catholic doctrine – and we certainly would expect Catholic leaders to hold to Catholic doctrine – are not Christians because Catholicism anathematizes the biblical gospel.)

‘Jesus was right next to me’: Asbury revival sets Catholics on fire with Holy Spirit

đŸ”„Is it possible for an unbeliever who anathematizes the biblical gospel (i.e. believes and teaches that anyone who believes the biblical gospel is condemned to Hell) to be “set on fire with the Holy Spirit”? According to Scripture, what is the function of the Holy Spirit in the life of an unbeliever?

There has been one (that I’m aware of) instance of someone allegedly exorcising a demon during the meetings. If you’re familiar with the trappings of the New Apostolic Reformation, you know that what you see in the video below goes hand in glove with the NAR’s heretical theology of “spiritual warfare”.

đŸ”„Does a “tree” (see Matthew passage above) of sound doctrine produce heretical fruit? Would this type of incident be likely to happen at any doctrinally sound church you know of? If not, why not? If so, how would it have been handled by the pastors and elders?

What Other Biblically Trustworthy Voices Are Saying

đŸ”„Some have said it’s sinful or wrong to biblically critique the Asbury meetings without physically going there to experience it personally in real time. Does the Bible require us to be physically present while something is happening in order to experience it personally before making informed, biblical evaluation, observation, or critique?

If yes, have you ever evaluated the Holocaust or slavery as sinful? Have you ever said that Mormonism, Hinduism, Satanism, etc., were unbiblical, having never practiced one of those religions yourself? Consider this passage in which Jesus comments on events at which He was not physically present.

The Mailbag: Applying Twisted Scripture to Pseudo-“Christian” Events, Ideas, and Fads

Is The Asbury “Revival” A Real Revival? by Samuel Sey

Let’s have some real talk about this whole Asbury revival thing. We’ll start with a lesson from the Western Front. at Not the Bee

The Asbury Revival: observations from a local pastor at The Cripplegate

Why It’s Good to be Skeptical of the Asbury Revival at The Cripplegate

Can Anything Good Come Out of Asbury?

đŸ”„Consider these passages. God is able to take any sin, any false doctrine, any bad situation, and use it for His glory and our good. What are some scripturally good, doctrinally sound things that could happen as a result of the meetings at Asbury?

đŸ”„What are some things doctrinally sound Christians and churches could do to reach out to and help the students at Asbury?

đŸ”„When someone hears the biblical gospel and gets genuinely saved while still a member of a “bad tree” belief system or a follower of a false teacher, does she stay in that unbiblical environment or does God grow her and bring her out of it? What is something you could do to share the gospel with and disciple someone caught in a false belief system?

Church

Throwback Tuesday ~ Revive Us Again

Michelle Lesley

I’m flip-flopping the blog schedule a tad this week.
Enjoy this week’s Throwback Thursday – on Tuesday!

Originally published August 12, 2009

Thirty three per cent of clergy and thirty six per cent of laymen
report having visited a sexually explicit web site.
Christianity Today survey, August 2000

The divorce rate of born-again Christians (32%)
is higher than that of atheists and agnostics (30%).
Barna Research Group 20081

Twenty per cent of women who have abortions
are born-again or Evangelical Christians.
The Alan Guttmacher Institute, 1996

We rarely find substantial differences between
the moral behavior of Christians and non-Christians.
George Barna, Founder, Barna Research Group

You are the salt of the earth; but if the salt has become tasteless,
how can it be made salty again?
It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out
and trampled under foot by men.
Jesus, Matthew 5:13

Once upon a time, when I was a little girl, my parents took my sister and me to visit some of our elder relatives. For the evening meal, the lady of the house set a beautiful, formal table, complete with lovely crystal salt cellars at each place.

Having attended approximately zero formal dinners in my decade-long, casual dining existence, I had never seen a salt cellar. Since it happened to be sitting next to my goblet of unsweetened iced tea, I presumed it was my own personal sugar bowl.

I was puzzled as to why the spoon was so tiny, but forged ahead in an attempt to sweeten my tea with spoonful after spoonful
of salt. After one swig, I realized my mistake, but to maintain decorum, I did my best to eat my meal while taking an occasional small sip of the tea-flavored salt water. It was a long dinner.

I have never been so thirsty for a fresh drink of water before—or since—that moment.

We, the body of Christ, are supposed to be salt. Look around. How are we doing? By and large, instead of the church making the world thirsty for the Living Water, we have become so worldly ourselves that we are in danger of losing our savor altogether.

The Western church, the American church, the local church, maybe even your church—is in desperate need of revival. Not a revival meeting. Revival.

Revival is not a special event to win the lost. It is a time when God’s people, both individually and corporately, humble themselves, cry out to God in repentance and return to a fresh, empowered, obedient love relationship with Him.

Aren’t you tired of seeing statistics like the ones at the beginning of this article? Tired of the church having so little impact on a lost and dying world? Tired of simply going through the motions in your spiritual life and at church? Have you ever, as I have, taken a step back, looked at your walk and your worship, and said, “There’s got to be more to the Christian life than this”?

There is more. Much more. God desires that we have a full, exciting, vibrant, dynamic relationship with Him. But it’s going to cost us. It will cost our pride, our time, our repentance, our obedience, and our priority. It will require that we become dissatisfied and uncomfortable with the status quo of complacency.

I think we’re up for the challenge.

Turn away my eyes from looking at vanity,
and revive me in Your ways.
Psalm 119:37

 

1Take these statistics with a “grain of salt”. :0) Not everyone who claims to be a “born-again Christian” in a poll actually is one, the divorce stat has subsequently been proved false, etc. The idea is that the world has infiltrated the church, and the church has embraced the world, and therefore, the behavior of way too many professing Christians is worldly.

Church

Throwback Thursday ~ Cleaning House

Michelle Lesley

Originally published May 5, 2010

Hezekiah became king when he was twenty-five years old;…

He did right in the sight of the LORD, according to all that his father David had done.

In the first year of his reign, in the first month, he opened the doors of the house of the LORD and repaired them.

He brought in the priests and the Levites and gathered them into the square on the east.

Then he said to them, “Listen to me, O Levites. Consecrate yourselves now, and consecrate the house of the LORD, the God of your fathers, and carry the uncleanness out from the holy place.

“For our fathers have been unfaithful and have done evil in the sight of the LORD our God, and have forsaken Him and turned their faces away from the dwelling place of the LORD, and have turned their backs.

“They have also shut the doors of the porch and put out the lamps, and have not burned incense or offered burnt offerings in the holy place to the God of Israel.

“Therefore the wrath of the LORD was against Judah and Jerusalem, and He has made them an object of terror, of horror, and of hissing, as you see with your own eyes.

“For behold, our fathers have fallen by the sword, and our sons and our daughters and our wives are in captivity for this.

“Now it is in my heart to make a covenant with the LORD God of Israel, that His burning anger may turn away from us.

“My sons, do not be negligent now, for the LORD has chosen you to stand before Him, to minister to Him, and to be His ministers and burn incense.”

Then the Levites arose…
They assembled their brothers, consecrated themselves, and went in to cleanse the house of the LORD, according to the commandment of the king by the words of the LORD.

So the priests went in to the inner part of the house of the LORD to cleanse it, and every unclean thing which they found in the temple of the LORD they brought out to the court of the house of the LORD. Then the Levites received it to carry out to the Kidron valley…

Then they went in to King Hezekiah and said, “We have cleansed the whole house of the LORD, the altar of burnt offering with all of its utensils, and the table of showbread with all of its utensils.

“Moreover, all the utensils which King Ahaz had discarded during his reign in his unfaithfulness, we have prepared and consecrated; and behold, they are before the altar of the LORD.”

Then King Hezekiah arose early and assembled the princes of the city and went up to the house of the LORD.

They brought seven bulls, seven rams, seven lambs and seven male goats for a sin offering for the kingdom, the sanctuary, and Judah. And he ordered the priests, the sons of Aaron, to offer them on the altar of the LORD…
The priests slaughtered them and purged the altar with their blood to atone for all Israel, for the king ordered the burnt offering and the sin offering for all Israel.

He then stationed the Levites in the house of the LORD with cymbals, with harps and with lyres,…

The Levites stood with the musical instruments of David, and the priests with the trumpets.

Then Hezekiah gave the order to offer the burnt offering on the altar. When the burnt offering began, the song to the LORD also began with the trumpets, accompanied by the instruments of David, king of Israel.

While the whole assembly worshiped, the singers also sang and the trumpets sounded; all this continued until the burnt offering was finished.

Now at the completion of the burnt offerings, the king and all who were present with him bowed down and worshiped.

Moreover, King Hezekiah and the officials ordered the Levites to sing praises to the LORD with the words of David and Asaph the seer. So they sang praises with joy, and bowed down and worshiped.

Then Hezekiah said, “Now that you have consecrated yourselves to the LORD, come near and bring sacrifices and thank offerings to the house of the LORD ” And the assembly brought sacrifices and thank offerings, and all those who were willing brought burnt offerings…

But the priests were too few, so that they were unable to skin all the burnt offerings;

There were also many burnt offerings with the fat of the peace offerings and with the libations for the burnt offerings. Thus the service of the house of the LORD was established again.

Then Hezekiah and all the people rejoiced over what God had prepared for the people…

Excerpted from 2 Chronicles 29

You know the history of Israel: bad king, good king, bad king, good king (actually, there were a lot more bad kings than good kings). The bad kings would come in and establish idol worship. They set up altars and made sacrifices to false gods, introduced cult prostitution, and even desecrated God’s house with idol worship and paraphernalia.

Ahaz was one of those bad kings. Second Kings 16 and 2 Chronicles 28 tell us he not only burned incense and made sacrifices to his gods, he “even made his sons pass through the fire” in worship of these idols. He took the gold and silver from God’s house and used it to try to bribe another king to come help him fight against an enemy. He desecrated God’s altar and tore down parts of the temple. He cut to pieces all of the temple utensils used for making sacrifices to the Lord. He had altars to his own gods placed in the temple, “in every corner of Jerusalem”, and “in every city in Judah”.

Ahaz was one bad dude. In fact, he was such a pustule of a human being that when he died they didn’t even bury him with all the other kings of Israel. That’s pretty bad.

And Hezekiah, Ahaz’s son, became king in his place.

Hezekiah was one of the most godly kings in Israel’s history. He had seen with his own eyes the evil perpetrated by his father, which had infested God’s holy house and spread throughout the land, and God put it in his heart to turn things around and lead his people back to God.

See any similarities between God’s house then and God’s house now? Between God’s people then and God’s people now? Is it time for us to grieve over the holy things that have been destroyed or taken out of God’s house, and the filth that has been brought into His house?

We’ve got to sweep around our own front door.

Notice that Hezekiah didn’t just go out and get a bunch of guys together and say, “All right, boys, we need to clean house. Let’s get to work.” He went specifically to the priests and Levites – the church leadership, if you will – and said, “consecrate yourselves”.

Consecration was a process of ritual cleansing. As the priests and Levites went through each step of the outward, physical cleansing, they were also setting themselves apart from worldliness and seeking God’s hand of purification in their hearts.

Notice also that the priests and Levites had to consecrate themselves before they would be able to consecrate the temple. Just as Ahaz’s own personal evildoing had trickled down and infected the people, so the temple leadership would have to cleanse themselves personally before God in order for a pursuit of holiness to pervade God’s house and His people.

Those who study revival have noted that the majority of churches which experience revival do so under the leadership of a pastor who has experienced personal revival. If a pastor senses it’s time to clean house at his church, step one is to make sure he has consecrated himself and is walking blamelessly before God. Step two is to get his leadership together for times of cleansing and much prayer, that they may consecrate themselves before leading the people.

Once their personal cleansing was complete, the priests and Levites began to “carry the uncleanness out from the holy place”. The evil done in the temple in Ahaz’s day had harmed families, stirred God to anger, and made His people “an object of terror, of horror, and of hissing” in the eyes of the world around them. Likewise, the worldliness and sin – from gossip and jealousy all the way up to pedophile clergy – we have allowed into the church has brought tremendous harm to countless families and has made the body of Christ an object of ridicule and hatred in the eyes of many of the people we seek to reach for Him. Can we expect that His anger towards us would be any less than his anger towards the Israelites?

When the priests and Levites began to cleanse the temple, they did so completely and permanently. In the same spirit of Jesus’ own remarks that if your very hand or eye causes you to sin, you should remove it from your body, the priests and Levites removed everything – no matter how small, no matter how valuable it may have seemed, or how much its removal might have offended someone – that didn’t belong in God’s house.

Verse 16 tells us they carried all these unclean things out to the Kidron valley. The Kidron valley (or brook, as it was sometimes called when water was running through the valley due to heavy rains) was an area outside Jerusalem where, under Kings Asa, Josiah, and Hezekiah, all manner of unclean items used in idol worship were disposed of, usually by burning. That’s permanent. They weren’t taking any chances that someone might come across these items and bring them back into the temple.

Not only did the priests and Levites take all the unclean items out of God’s house, they purified and brought back all of the sacred items used for worshiping God that never should have been removed.

Is it time to carry the unclean things out of your church and down to the Kidron valley? Maybe it’s an unbiblical doctrinal tenet of your denomination. A program that brings glory only to the church members involved and not to God. A person in a position of church leadership who intentionally lives in sin and rebellion. An attitude of your own heart.

What about the holy items of worship that have been taken out of your church? Have sound, Biblical sermons been replaced by ear tickling pep talks and skits? Have Scriptural and doctrinal worship songs been replaced by the vain repetition of fluffy, feel-good jingles? Has prayer become simply a way to bookend your worship services or even disappeared altogether?

Our churches are in captivity to worldliness due to our disobedience. God has chosen our pastors to minister before Him; to lead His people to be consecrated to Him and worship Him. Dear pastor, please do not be negligent about cleansing His house. For the sake of us, the sheep God has entrusted to you, won’t you go into the innermost part of the house of God – your heart, your family, your staff – and through humility, prayer, study of the Word, and sound biblical action, remove every unclean thing, and bring back the sacred things with the help of your church leadership?

Only when God’s house is clean will we be able to offer Him the sacrifices He truly desires:

Thus the service of the house of the Lord will established again, and the people will rejoice over what God has prepared for them.

Holidays (Other)

Is 2 Chronicles 7:14 God’s Promise to American Christians Today?

Michelle Lesley

Originally published July 3, 2015

Is 2 Chronicles 7:14 God’s promise to American Christians today?

“if my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and heal their land.”
2 Chronicles 7:14

This verse is often quoted as a call to prayer and revival for American Christians, suggesting that if we pray, repent, and humble ourselves, God will turn America around and make it “one nation under God” again. Since it’s 4th of July week, you’ve probably been seeing this verse in your news feeds, but is it really a promise to us today about America?

2ch714
Photo courtesy of Please Convince Me.

Not this particular verse, no. Here’s why:

1. This verse is only part of a sentence (you can tell by the way it starts with a lowercase letter). In order to rightly handle God’s word (2 Timothy 2:15), it’s imperative that we consider a verse’s immediate context as well as the way it fits in with the big picture of the entire Bible. Even adding just verses 13 and 15 shows us that this verse was written about Old Testament Israel, not America. Reading all of chapter 7 sheds even more light on this verse, and if we throw in chapter 6, especially 6:26-31, we can clearly see that 7:14 is part of God’s specific answer to Solomon’s prayer at the dedication of the temple.

2. There are no supporting Scriptures in the New Testament (remember, Believers are in the church era under the new covenant of grace) that imply that if Christians humble themselves and repent that God will give them a nation governed by biblical laws and leaders and that we will have a society that behaves itself, morally. In fact, in the New Testament, in the early church, we see the exact opposite. The more the church prayed, humbled itself, and spread the gospel, the more Rome persecuted Christians. And yet, we never hear of them claiming 2 Chronicles 7:14 as God’s promise to them that He would turn things around if they would only humble themselves and seek His face more. The New Testament, even Jesus Himself, says that we will be persecuted for godly living (John 15:20, Matthew 10:22, 2 Timothy 3:12-13).

3. We can’t claim the promise without claiming the punishment. Look again at verse 13. It specifies that pestilence and the agricultural hardships of drought and locust infestation are the ones that God promises to heal. It is a promise of literal healing of the land so that crops will grow unharmed, game will be plentiful, and people will be healthy and able to eat, not a promise of a metaphorical “healing” of a nation’s immorality.

If we claim that this “healing of the land” applies to us today, then we also have to claim that God will punish our disobedience with those very things He promises to heal (drought, locusts, and pestilence), because that’s what these verses are talking about.

4. The reason this passage sounds like it applies to us is because there are some principles in this verse that do apply to us. How do we know? Because they are supported by other clear and direct Scriptures:

Are we God’s people who are called by His name”? Yes (Acts 11:26)

Should we humble ourselves? Yes (1 Peter 5:6)

Should we pray and seek God’s face? Yes (1 Thessalonians 5:17)

Should we turn from any wicked ways we practice? Yes (Acts 3:19)

Will God hear from Heaven if we do these things? Yes (1 John 5:14-15)

Does God promise to heal our land of bad morals or the agricultural problems He has punished our disobedience with if we do these things? No.

Asking God to fulfill His promises and thanking Him for those already fulfilled is a wonderful and worshipful way to pray. But, if we truly want to pray “in the name of Jesus” and pray rightly for God’s will to be done, we must use wisdom, discernment, and the tools God has given us to discover exactly what He has promised us.

For further reading:

Properly Praying the Promises by Michelle Lesley

What is the meaning of 2 Chronicles 7:14? at Got Questions?

Mailbag

The Mailbag: Potpourri (Paul’s gospel, National repentance, Pastor search committee, Pastor’s wife teaching men)

Michelle Lesley

Welcome to another “potpourri” edition of The Mailbag, where I give short(er) answers to several questions rather than a long answer to one question. I also like to take the opportunity in these potpourri editions to let new readers know about my comments/e-mail/messages policy. I’m not able to respond individually to most e-mails and messages, so here are some helpful hints for getting your questions answered more quickly. Remember, the search bar (at the very bottom of each page) can be a helpful tool!

In these potpourri editions of The Mailbag, I’d also like to address the three questions I’m most commonly asked:

“Do you know anything about [Christian pastor/teacher/author] or his/her materials? Is he/she doctrinally sound?”

Try these links: 
Popular False Teachers / Recommended Bible Teachers / search bar
Is She a False Teacher? 7 Steps to Figuring It Out on Your Own
(Do keep bringing me names, though. If I get enough questions about a particular teacher, I’ll probably write an article on her.)

“Can you recommend a good women’s Bible study?”

No. Here’s why:
The Mailbag: Can you recommend a good Bible study for women/teens/kids?
The Mailbag: “We need to stop relying on canned studies,” doesn’t mean, “We need to rely on doctrinally sound canned studies.”.

“You shouldn’t be warning against [popular false teacher] for [X,Y,Z] reason!”

Answering the Opposition- Responses to the Most Frequently Raised Discernment Objections

Didn’t the risen Christ give Paul the Gospel of salvation by grace through faith? Paul called it “my gospel”? Is the Great Commission the same as Paul’s gospel? Thanks!

Not exactly, but it’s great that you’re noticing those little details as you study God’s Word!

“Paul’s” gospel…

Remember Jesus Christ, risen from the dead, the offspring of David, as preached in my gospel, 2 Timothy 2:8

…is the biblical gospel of salvation that Paul preached – the good news of what Christ did to save sinners through His death, burial, and resurrection – and the call to repentance and belief.

The Great Commission…

And Jesus came and said to them, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all that I have commanded you. And behold, I am with you always, to the end of the age.” Matthew 28:18-20

…is the church’s (and individual Christians’) “marching orders” to share that gospel with sinners and disciple them to maturity in Christ. It is God’s main purpose for the church.

So, in a nutshell, the gospel is what Christ did. The Great Commission is what we’re supposed to do with the gospel.

I got into quite the discussion with people today who feel that prayers of repentance for our national sins are not only unnecessary, but an affront to them because THEY did nothing wrong. I cited Daniel who prayed prayers of repentance for his nation, though he led a righteous life. They got all confused with Old Testament sacrificial law and that Christ was the ultimate sacrifice so we only need repent of our OWN sins. Could you address this, please?

Well…depending on exactly what they were saying, they may have been at least partly right. We can certainly pray that God will lead individuals in our nation to repent of whatever sins they may have committed, but we cannot repent on behalf of another person or of a nation. God does not hold us responsible for the sins of others, and we cannot repent for the sins of others. (see Ezekiel 18).

If you’re referring to Daniel’s prayer in Daniel 9, if you’ll read very carefully, you’ll notice he is confessing the sin of his people, lamenting over the sin of his people, and asking God to pour out His mercy on his people despite their sin, but he is not repenting on their behalf.

It is impossible to repent for someone else’s (let alone a whole nation’s) sin because repenting is more than:

  • confessing that sin has occurred,
  • admitting that someone is guilty for having committed that sin,
  • feeling sorrowful over sin,
  • asking forgiveness for sin, or
  • asking God to be merciful toward the sinner.

Repentance means to turn away from your sin, to forsake it, to stop doing it because you want to obey God instead. Although I’m sure he wished he could have, Daniel could not turn away from someone else’s (the nation of Israel’s) sin. And, he specifically says in verse 13: “we have not entreated the favor of the Lord our God, turning from our iniquities”.

Another thing to remember is that Daniel is interceding for God’s covenant people. They belonged to Him. They had agreed to follow Him. America is not in a covenant relationship with God. For a Christian today, interceding for the church and praying that God would lead Christians to repentance would be more analogous to what Daniel was doing.

We lost our pastor almost a year ago and are struggling to find a new one. Do you have any suggestions of where we could send the information about our church and the position in hopes of finding a suitable candidate?

I would suggest sending your information to:

The Master’s Seminary’s Pastor Search page

Founders Ministries Minister Search page

Expositors Seminary

I hope you’ll find a wonderful, godly pastor very soon!

Now, although this might not be possible for your particular church, I would like to throw something out there for the consideration of any pastor or church member who might be reading this. The most biblical model of leadership for the local church is that it be led by a plurality of elders.Âč For that primary reason, I would encourage every church that doesn’t already have this leadership structure in place to look into it and give strong, prayerful consideration to transitioning into leadership by a plurality of elders.

However, secondarily, there are practical benefits to your church being led by a plurality of elders, and avoiding being “pastorless” is a huge one. My own church recently welcomed a new pastor after being without one for two full years. That two years was a struggle. The interim pastor was a stranger to us and we were strangers to him. He did not know the ins and outs of life at our church or the strengths and weaknesses of our church. As affable as our interim pastor was, it was always in the back of everyone’s mind that he was temporary. This was not our pastor and everyone knew it. And then there were some other issues that arose during his tenure that awaited the new pastor’s arrival.

When a church is led by a plurality of elders, many of these issues can be avoided or lessened. When a lead teaching elder dies, moves, or steps down for whatever reason, there is, ideally, already another elder available to step in and take over. This elder already knows the church and the people and they know him. There’s no need to assemble and train a pastor search committee, launch a nationwide search, wait on resumes to arrive, interview candidates, present them to the church for a vote, and then hire a stranger about whom you know virtually nothing except what’s on his resume and whatever he says in his interview. The transition from elder to elder is smoother and immediate with little upheaval and relational trauma to the church body.

Just something to think about.

ÂčI’m not saying that churches which aren’t elder-led are apostate or intrinsically sinful, I’m just saying that if you want to get as close to the biblical model as possible, go with a plurality of elders.

I am a relatively new (about one year old –  but growing in discernment!) Christian, and I attend a small Baptist church of about 15 people in the remote area in which I live. The pastor’s wife leads both men and women in a “Bible” study group using popular (biblically questionable at best, such as Max Lucado) books instead of reading Scripture. I choose not to attend these studies, but because the church is so small, my absence is obvious and noticed. People comment that they have not seen me at “Bible” study. 

Everything else that happens in the church, the sermons, worship, prayer, are all on point biblically, thus far. My pastor is a godly man as far as I can tell, so my only issue to date is these co-ed, led by a woman, “not-Bible” studies. Should I take my concerns to my pastor? I’m already on a bit of shaky ground with the pastor’s wife. I’m reluctant to upset the apple cart any more. However, if the right thing to do is to address it and deal with potential consequences (shunning, whatever) then I want to do the right thing by my Lord and Savior. How would you guide me in this situation?

I know this is a really difficult situation to be in and I’m sorry it’s making you uncomfortable at church. Yes, when we see sin in the camp, we must speak up, so you should begin preparing to address this situation. Normally, I encourage women to go to the person most directly in charge of the issue first, which in this case would be the pastor’s wife, but I’m guessing that if you’re on “shaky ground” with her it’s because you’ve already tried to address this with her. The next step is to go to the pastor.

I would encourage you to spend a little time studying through the book of Esther, realizing that she was in a somewhat similar situation to yours: God revealed to her an ungodly situation that would harm His people, and she – at great personal risk – had to go to the man in charge and implore him to right the situation, not knowing how he would respond. It could be that God has specifically placed you in this church “for such a time as this”.

Notice that Esther asked that her people be gathered to pray for her. If you have any like-minded friends or loved ones who will pray with you as you prepare your heart to talk to your pastor, that would be beneficial. I have already prayed for you, and I am asking everyone reading this to stop and take a moment to pray for you as well.

If the pastor tells you you’re wrong or doesn’t rectify the situation, and there’s another, better church you could join, even if it’s not as convenient as this one, prayerfully consider moving your membership there. If, as you said, everything else at your current church really is doctrinally sound, and you have no other options for a doctrinally sound church to attend that’s within achievable driving distance of your house, my counsel to you would be to stay at this church, continue not to attend the “not-Bible” study, and fervently pray for God to change the hearts of your pastor and his wife.

If you stay and people continue to say, “We missed you at ‘Bible’ study!” all you have to say is, “Thank you!” or “It’s nice to be missed,” or something like that. I can’t speak for everyone, but when I say, “I missed you at _____,” to someone, it’s not a demand to know why she wasn’t there, it’s to let her know that I love her and missed fellowshipping with her. Hopefully, that’s all your fellow church members mean by saying that. If a nosy Nelly asks why you weren’t there, keep in mind that you’re not required to give her that information just because she asked. You can say something like, “I have a conflict and can’t attend,” which is truthful (you have a biblical conflict and can’t, in good conscience, attend), yet gives no one the opportunity to say that you were gossiping or trying to stir up division in the church. If she continues to pry, look her dead in the eye and keep repeating, “I have a conflict and can’t attend” until she comes to her senses and realizes it’s none of her business why you weren’t there.

Here are some resources I hope will help you:

Rock Your Role: Jill in the Pulpit

The Mailbag: How should I approach my church leaders about a false teacher they’re introducing?

Searching for a new church?

If you have a question about: a Bible passage, an aspect of theology, a current issue in Christianity, or how to biblically handle a family, life, or church situation, comment below (I’ll hold all questions in queue {unpublished} for a future edition of The Mailbag) or send me an e-mail or private message. If your question is chosen for publication, your anonymity will be protected.