Mailbag – Page 23 – Michelle Lesley

In the past, I’ve received some responses/comments on this issue from Christians who seem very angry that anybody is still in the SBC. While I share your righteous anger at the sin being committed in the SBC (and at those committing it), please don’t let your anger spill over onto your brothers and sisters who are still attempting to navigate this situation in a godly way in the context of their own families and local churches. Angry/accusatory comments will not be published.

“How could any doctrinally sound Christian possibly stay in the Southern Baptist Convention after all of this?”

“I’ve been watching what’s going on in the SBC. I know all SBC churches are autonomous, but, after what I’ve seen, I’m now suspicious of the doctrine of any church that decides to stay in the SBC. As a doctrinally sound Christian, I’ll never set foot in another SBC church.”

“If you don’t like what’s going on in the SBC, why don’t you just leave? If you stay in, you have no right to complain!”

This is just a representative sampling of the scores of comments and questions I’ve received and seen over the past couple of months regarding Christians remaining in Southern Baptist churches, and Southern Baptist churches remaining in the Southern Baptist Convention.

Here’s a blow by blow (see “Additional Resources” section) of the specifics of the 2022 annual meeting of the SBC which took place last month in Anaheim. After reading about it, maybe you’ll be scratching your head and asking some of these same questions.

I’m kinda scratching my own head about how to answer, because, to be perfectly transparent, I have some of these same questions.

I’ve been Southern Baptist since the day I was born. It’s not like I just jumped on this turnip truck last week. I’ve been watching the downward spiral of the SBC for years, and it’s only picking up speed.

I’m neither a prophet, nor the son of a prophet, but I can tell you this (maybe from years of experience studying the culture of false teachers, false doctrine, and apostate churches) – without God directly intervening in a miraculous way, the SBC is not coming back from this. We are not going to turn anything around at next year’s Convention in New Orleans. The biblical side of the aisle will continue to lose and the unbiblical side of the aisle will continue to win. The worldly powers that be in the SBC are going to keep pursuing this course of downgrade until it hits rock bottom. I see unconditional acceptance of female “pastors” happening in the next 5-8 years. Acceptance of homosexuality will be next.

The SBC is *not* coming back from this. We are not going to turn anything around at next year’s Convention in New Orleans.
Tweet

I hope I’m wrong. No one will rejoice more loudly than I if I’m wrong. But I don’t think it’s going to shake out that way.

So, if it were as easy as pushing a button or snapping my fingers, I, as an individual, would have been out of the SBC about 5+ years ago.

But it’s not that simple, so maybe I’d better explain.

The first thing that’s imperative to understanding why your doctrinally sound friend might be staying in the SBC is our doctrine of the autonomy of the local church. The SBC isn’t technically a denomination, like Presbyterians or Lutherans. We do not have a hierarchy that rules over every church or organization under its purview. The SBC is a voluntary cooperative of individual, autonomous churches.

When we first got started back in 1845, the main idea was for all these little tiny, far flung rural churches to band together to pool their resources to send out and support missionaries, because they couldn’t afford to do so individually. And that’s still one of our main purposes today. But we didn’t set up a governing hierarchy. Each church governed itself as it saw fit according to Scripture and congregational conscience. The leadership structure we now have in place is basically for the purpose of administrating the business (properties, entities, money, etc.) of the Convention as directed by the churches. We are a “bottom up,” not “top down,” organization. The president of the SBC isn’t the “Baptist Pope”. The Executive Committee isn’t an ecclesiastical court. The annual meeting isn’t some sort of SBC legislature handing down edicts that every Southern Baptist church and individual is required to obey. In theory, every SBC church could disagree with and operate in opposition to virtually everyone and everything at the national, state, and local level of the SBC, and still be a member in good standing of all three. Local churches govern themselves.

Next, you need to understand that most Southern Baptists aren’t Southern Baptists because they woke up one morning, did a comparative analysis of the doctrines of all denominations, liked SBC doctrine the best, and, thus, went in search of an SBC church to join. Usually, it’s a) someone was born and raised Southern Baptist and she agrees with SBC doctrine and theology, so she hasn’t been compelled to (or can’t) find a better denomination and leave the SBC, or, b) someone who, for whatever reason, is looking for a new church, and the most doctrinally sound church she can find in her area is a Southern Baptist church (which is not uncommon). For many of us, it’s a combination of both.

In other words, Southern Baptist individuals aren’t Southern Baptist because they set out to join a denomination. They’re Southern Baptist because they joined a local church. And because that local church is a member of the SBC, that individual is now Southern Baptist, too, whether she wants to be or not.

So when you ask a Southern Baptist individual, “If you don’t like the SBC, why don’t you just leave it?” it’s not like asking her to cancel her Netflix subscription and opt for Hulu instead. You’re not asking her to write a letter of resignation to some impersonal national organization and stop paying her membership dues. You’re asking her to leave her local church. A church which may have been her spiritual family for decades. A church which might be perfectly doctrinally sound. In her area, it might be the most doctrinally sound church available, and you’re asking her to leave it to go to a less doctrinally sound church, just to cut ties with the SBC.

When you ask a Southern Baptist individual, “If you don’t like the SBC, why don’t you just leave it?” it’s not like asking her to cancel her Netflix subscription and opt for Hulu instead. You’re asking her to leave her *local church*.
Tweet

So, considering all the Southern Baptists I know and have heard from, and taking all of the above into account, there are three main categories of people who are still in the SBC that I’d like to take a moment to address, and anywhere from three to a scrillion different ways they could biblically deal with being Southern Baptist while seeing all of these godless things taking place on the national SBC stage:

You’re a doctrinally sound, discerning Christian in a local SBC church whose pastor and leadership agree with the unbiblical goings on at the national level. You need to get out of that church, probably immediately, and find a doctrinally sound local church to join. You should strongly and prayerfully consider finding a non-SBC, and honestly, probably a non-denominational (because most of the problems in the SBC are happening in all the other denominations, too, or soon will) or independent church. However, if the best church you can find in your area is an SBC church that’s fighting against the sin and evil at the national level, don’t hesitate to join it and join them in the fight.

You’re a doctrinally sound, discerning Christian in a doctrinally sound local SBC church whose pastor and leadership are fighting against the unbiblical goings on at the national level. If your position is, “I want our church to leave the SBC immediately,” and your pastor’s / elders’ position is, “We’ve prayed about it and searched the Scriptures about it, and for X, Y, and Z biblical reason, we believe God would have us stay in one more year and fight,” and that’s basically the only disagreement you have with them, that’s not a reason to leave a good, solid church. Submit to your pastors’ leadership, trust them, support them, trust God, hang in there, be patient, and be sanctified by this as you watch and pray.

You’re a pastor of a doctrinally sound local SBC church and you’re positionally against and/or actively fighting against the unbiblical goings on at the national (and probably state and local, too) level. How long do you stay in and keep fighting? Obviously, it’s not my place to tell you what to do, but, from the perspective of a church member who’s been carefully keeping apprised of the SBC situation for a lot of years, could I just throw out a few questions you may want to consider between you and the Lord as you pray through the monumental decision of whether to lead your congregation to get out now or to stay in and fight for a while?

–Have you carefully examined your reasons and motivations for wanting to stay in and fight? Are those reasons and motivations drawn from Scripture? Pragmatism? The flesh? Have you considered these Scriptures with regard to leaving?

–What is your exit strategy? Will you stay in until you see how next year’s Convention goes? Until the SBC approves of women pastors? Homosexuality? Biblically, do you not have a responsibility as a shepherd and a Christian to draw a “this far and no farther” line in the sand? Where is that line?

–How much time, energy, and money have you and your church already expended on what will almost certainly be a losing fight? Is it good stewardship of your resources to continue to put them toward this fight? Could they be better spent in another way to get more Kingdom “bang for your buck”?

–I’ve heard some pastors say, “I want to stay in because of our missionaries.”. The sinful ideologies poisoning the SBC have not and will not leave the IMB untouched (and we know NAMB already requires its church planters to preach a false gospel). If it’s not happening already, your missions money may soon be funding the spread of false doctrine. Can you have that on your conscience? If you’re certain the SBC missionaries your church currently directly supports are doctrinally sound, have you looked into how you could support them from outside the SBC? Can you trust God to provide for them if you’re biblically compelled to lead your church to leave the SBC? What about supporting non-SBC, doctrinally sound missions agencies like TMAI and HeartCry?

–Carefully consider the second bolded quote at the beginning of this article. Is it possible your church’s good reputation is being tarnished by remaining in the SBC? “The world is watching!” we’ve been hearing for a couple of years now. Maybe it was said with the wrong motives, but it’s true. And the rest of Christendom has been watching too. Will staying in the SBC lead doctrinally sound Christians looking for a good solid church to pass yours over because they think you agree with the SBC’s sinful shenanigans since you haven’t left yet?

–If you’re going to stay in and fight, may I encourage you to start now? Right now. Today. I love all my brothers and sisters in the “stay in and fight” camp, but the past few years I’ve been extremely frustrated at the general way everything seems to be thrown together in a last minute scramble to rally the troops in the last few months, weeks, and days before the Convention.

Make plans to attend the New Orleans meeting now, raise funds to send messengers now, nominate godly candidates for SBC offices now, and tour them around to local churches all year long to build momentum. And most importantly, educate your church and your local association’s churches on the issues and the biblical response to those issues, now. Don’t wait until April, May, and June of next year, start now.

–Watch and listen to this SBC pastor talk about the issues in the SBC that led to his decision to lead his church out of the SBC. A must watch for every pastor and congregation that’s still in the Southern Baptist Convention:

Last year, I wrote When is it time to leave the SBC?. I can’t decide that for your church or mine. I just want to know, what’s one good, compelling, biblical reason to stay? Because I can think of lots of good, compelling, biblical reasons to leave.

I just want to know, what’s one good, compelling, biblical reason to stay in the SBC? Because I can think of lots of good, compelling, biblical reasons to leave.
Tweet

Additional Resources

Watch the entirety of SBC22 on Baptist Press’ YouTube channel

Thinking Out Loud at A Word Fitly Spoken

Californication: Anaheim, the SBC, and Spiritual Adultery by Allen Nelson

The Liberal Drift of the Southern Baptist Convention (Part 1) (Part 2) by Gabriel Hughes

SBC22 Recap – Encouragements and Disappointments with Tom Ascol and Graham Gunden

Is it time to leave the Southern Baptist Convention? And, what’s a secondary issue? by Elizabeth Prata

Will Egalitarianism Rule the SBC? by Josh Buice

Will Feminists Win the Pulpit? by Virgil Walker

If you have a question about: a Bible passage, an aspect of theology, a current issue in Christianity, or how to biblically handle a family, life, or church situation, comment below (I’ll hold all questions in queue {unpublished} for a future edition of The Mailbag) or send me an e-mail or private message. If your question is chosen for publication, your anonymity will be protected.

Mailbag, Southern Baptist/SBC

The Mailbag: When is it time to leave the SBC?

May 16, 2022May 16, 2022 Michelle Lesley

Originally published June 14, 2021

At what point does one leave the SBC? I know there are other doctrinally sound churches where one could worship. When would “guilt by association” turn into a stumbling block for others?

How will you be handling the possible debacle with the SBC? We are so torn about this situation. Any advice or words of wisdom would be greatly appreciated.

These are just a couple of the “Should I stay or should I go?” questions and comments I’ve received about the current state of the Southern Baptist Convention.

There’s no denying there are, and have been for decades, serious problems in the SBC, mainly at the national leadership level. If you’re a regular reader of my blog, over the past several weeks, you’ve been reading about those problems, both old and new.

How do you know when it’s time to stand and fight to correct the problems, and when it’s time to declare it a total loss and walk away? How long until staying in the trenches, pleading with the SBC to repent becomes, functionally, being unequally yoked with unbelievers, when it becomes apparent they have no intention of repenting and we refuse to break fellowship with them? Indeed, how can we know when or whether it’s time to leave any church or denomination with such seemingly insurmountable biblical problems?

I don’t know.

But I can tell you there’s Biblical support for both staying (for now) and leaving. As Ecclesiastes might say, “A time to contend for the faith, and a time to shake the dust off your feet and leave.”

In the Old Testament, we see God bearing with Pharaoh’s stiff-necked rebellion through ten plagues. We see Him patiently calling Israel out of idolatry for hundreds of years.

But He did destroy Pharaoh and his army at the end of those ten plagues. And He did eventually send Israel into exile when the time for His forbearance came to an end.

But we also see Jesus leaving the ninety-nine and pursuing the one sheep that went astray. We see the father of the prodigal watching and waiting for his son’s return.

Jesus brought that sheep back. And the prodigal did return in repentance.

God knew whether and when they would all come back, and how long to persist with each. How can we?

The only way to know is to ask Him. This is something every individual Southern Baptist, every Southern Baptist family, and every Southern Baptist church needs to be praying about, asking God for wisdom to know what to do and when the time is right.

If any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask God, who gives generously to all without reproach, and it will be given him.
James 1:5

And the answer is probably going to look different between different churches, different members of the same church, even different members of the same family.

And that’s OK. Already, some godly churches, families, and individuals have cut ties with the SBC. And that doesn’t mean they didn’t have enough faith or enough patience. Some godly churches, families, and individuals have determined to stick it out until things turn around or until the bitter end, whatever form that may take. And that doesn’t mean they’re compromising or naive.

God works in different ways in different hearts and circumstances because He created us as unique people and placed us in varying situations. He does that for His glory and our good. It’s a testament to how big and capable He is and His special care for each of us as His “one of a kind” child.

But, in addition to the privilege of prayer and God’s promise of wisdom, there’s another blessing God has given us in this situation – the blessing of authority and structure.

God has given us a hierarchy of authority in the church and the home that, when followed, pools the wisdom He has imparted to individuals and prevents any one person from bearing the responsibility for making this decision alone.

As an individual, you pray and search the Scriptures earnestly about this issue. If you’re married and your husband is a Believer, the two of you bring your individual convictions to the table, and pray and study on it, and, hopefully, come to a consensus on it (and, if not, you’ll need to submit to your husband’s position), together.

Next, married or not, you, or you and your family will need to find out where your church leadership is on all of this, if you don’t already know. If your pastor and elders haven’t already come together and talked to the church body about staying in or getting out, and why, you’ll need to set up an appointment with whichever one of them is appropriate and ask about their thoughts and position. If the issue of leaving or staying isn’t even on their radar yet, it would be an appropriate time for you and your husband to share your concerns and ask when they might address this issue.

My encouragement to you would be that if you are in a doctrinally sound Southern Baptist church, with trustworthy pastors and elders who are trying to do the right thing, biblically, give strong, prayerful consideration to following their leadership on this issue, even if you don’t see exactly eye to eye with their position.

Obey your leaders and submit to them, for they are keeping watch over your souls, as those who will have to give an account. Let them do this with joy and not with groaning, for that would be of no advantage to you.
Hebrews 13:17

Pray fervently for your pastor and elders about this. Pray for your husband as he seeks to lead your family in a godly direction. If you’re married, submit to your husband’s decision about whether and when to leave. If you’re single, if at all possible, submit to your pastor’s and elders’ decisions about staying or leaving.

There’s not a “one size fits all” solution to this issue. You, as an individual have to seek the Lord and obey Him in your unique situation.

May our gracious Lord give all of us wisdom and humility, and carry us through this difficult time.

Mailbag

The Mailbag: Potpourri (Breastfeeding videos…Women performing weddings…Only God is awesome?)

May 9, 2022May 9, 2022 Michelle Lesley

Welcome to another “potpourri” edition of The Mailbag, where I give short(er) answers to several questions rather than a long answer to one question.

I like to take the opportunity in these potpourri editions to let new readers know about my comments/e-mail/messages policy. I’m not able to respond individually to most e-mails and messages, so here are some helpful hints for getting your questions answered more quickly. Remember, the search bar (at the very bottom of each page) can be a helpful tool!

Or maybe I answered your question already? Check out my article The Mailbag: Top 10 FAQs to see if your question has been answered and to get some helpful resources.

For any men who might be reading – this question is about breastfeeding. If that’s a sensitive issue for you, please just scroll right on past this section.

I have searching for biblical content about breastfeeding and your post from 3 years ago “The Mailbag: Should Christian women cover up while breastfeeding? really did make think. I’m currently studying to become a pediatric dietitian if God allows it, and I have a debate in myself. I’m starting to create content in social media in order to teach about these topics: breastfeeding, nutrition, etc. But now I don’t know if it’ correct to share real videos that are educative to teach how to properly breastfeed, showing examples and different cases that help mothers to understand. Since it is shameful to show breast according to Bible, am I wrong if I am looking to share or record these types of videos? Just to clarify, these videos only shows the necessary.

I hope my email can reach you and have an advice for this, may the Lord continuing giving you wisdom and excuse me any grammatical error since english is not my first language.

Can I first just say – I have the utmost admiration for anyone who tackles English as a second language. Its intricacies and inconsistencies are often difficult even for us native speakers! When I get English messages from followers whose native language is not English, they almost always apologize for grammar and spelling errors. Please rest assured, when I read your messages, I’m not critiquing them, I’m wishing I were as proficient in a second language as you are!

Instructional videos for mothers about breastfeeding are not the same thing as a mother who is breastfeeding in public. For one thing, your videos are aimed specifically at women (new mothers), and for a legitimate purpose (teaching breastfeeding). If a man (assuming he’s not a health care worker who needs to view your videos for professional purposes) proactively clicks on and watches your videos in order to see women’s bare breasts, he is the one at fault, not you. His actions would be more similar to a man who peeks through the window of a woman’s bedroom to watch her breastfeed, not a man out in public, minding his own business, who’s suddenly confronted with a view of a woman’s breasts because she’s not making any effort to reasonably cover while nursing.

Additionally, aiming your videos at new mothers (women) is more similar to a woman breastfeeding her baby in a group meeting for new moms (all women), than out in public (random men and women present).

Here are a couple of things I would suggest:

Make sure the titles of your videos make it obvious in some way that they are educational, instructional videos on breastfeeding for new mothers and postpartum/neonatal healthcare workers.

Instead of, say, just posting these videos on your personal Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, etc., pages, set up a separate professional social media page or group specifically for your videos and other breastfeeding materials. (I would suggest also setting up a website and YouTube channel specifically for your breastfeeding materials.) Not only will this help build your professional online platform, but your male friends and family members won’t be randomly running across your videos (which might make them uncomfortable) every time they scroll through social media.

I think that’s really as far as your responsibility goes. Men have to take responsibility for what they view at some point, too. It’s not all on you.

I have a question about women who are ordained. My cousin is ordained to perform marriages in the state of South Carolina. Would that be considered the same as an ordained preacher and against I Timothy 2 teaching? As far as I know all she does is perform marriage ceremonies and does not “preach” in the pulpit.

Great question!

I’m thinking there might be a little confusion about the term “ordained” here. “Ordaining” is what a church does when it sets someone apart for ministry. “Licensing” is what the government does that allows a person to legally perform marriages recognized by the state.

For example, pastors, elders, and (usually) deacons are ordained by the church to their respective offices, but they are not automatically licensed to legally perform marriages. For that, they have to go downtown to the courthouse and fill out some paperwork. By the same token, people can go to the courthouse, fill out the paperwork, and become licensed to perform marriages, and never have set foot in a church in their lives.

So, I think maybe you mean your cousin is licensed by the state to perform marriages, not that she is ordained by her church to do so. (I’ve never heard of a church that ordains someone just to perform marriages, but if that’s what’s going on here, the more pressing problem is the church’s ecclesiology, not your cousin officiating at weddings.)

So let’s go with your cousin being licensed by the state, not ordained by the church: No, that’s not technically a violation of 1 Timothy 2:12, assuming she’s not preaching a sermon as part of the marriage ceremony. The biblical prohibition is against women pastoring, preaching to men, instructing men in the Scriptures, and holding unbiblical authority over men in the context of the church gathering.

But there are all kinds of variables that play into whether or not it’s wise or appropriate for her to be officiating weddings. Does your cousin profess to be a Christian? Where do these weddings take place – in a church, park, reception hall, beach, etc.? Is she performing these weddings, or being viewed as performing these weddings as an official representative of her church? (In other words, would those not in the know confuse her performing weddings for her being a pastor of her church?) Do the bride and groom profess to be Christians? If so, why would they not want their pastor (or at least a pastor) to perform the ceremony in their own church?

I’m just saying I would need to know a lot more, probably on a case by case basis, to weigh in on whether or not it’s actually a good idea for her to perform any or all of these wedding ceremonies.

FIRST, I want to say thank you for your recent list of doctrinally sound men. My reason for writing comes from referring to them as “awesome” in your social media post about them:

“Today on the blog: Check out these awesome men to follow and learn from…”

I would just would ask you to consider the use of the word “awesome” when it applies to “mere” men (or women, for that matter.) Never mind the “world,” but Christians use that word so freely when talking about truly “good” things (and we also use it for things like movies and ice cream.)

Is it wrong to want there to be a word that is reserved for God and what he does? When something is clearly a work of God, even working through a person, there are times I can agree that it is something awesome. But largely, the things we call awesome are not.

It’s always good to evaluate our words to make sure we are representing Christ well, and, no, it’s not wrong to want there to be a word that is reserved for God and what He does. But let me challenge us to take this a bit deeper than just the surface level use of a particular word.

I’ve received this same basic question a handful of times over the years, and the question has always been about the word “awesome”. And I just have two questions about that:

First, why “awesome”? I think a much stronger biblical case could be made against using “good” or “holy”.

I’m betting that, like the reader who wrote in, we all use the word “good” in the same ways the word “awesome” is used – “truly good things,” movies, ice cream, saying “Good dog!” etc. – because they both mean the same thing, except that awesome is a little more intense. And yet, while Scripture doesn’t speak to our use of the descriptor “awesome,” Jesus Himself addressed the use of the word “good” in Mark and Luke:

And a ruler asked him, “Good Teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?” And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.

Now, when we read this passage in context, we know that Jesus isn’t telling this guy (or us) that he shouldn’t call Him good, that he shouldn’t call anything good, that Jesus isn’t good, or that Jesus isn’t God. Quite the opposite of most of those, in fact.

He’s directing the rich young ruler’s attention to the fact that only God is completely good. That God is the only and perfect standard and embodiment of good. He was basically saying, “You’re calling me good in this context. Does that mean you’re prepared to call me God?”.

But what Jesus doesn’t say (here or anywhere else in Scripture) is, “Since only God is truly, completely, and perfectly good, you can’t use the word “good” to describe anything else.”. In fact God Himself uses the word “good” to describe other, lesser things besides Himself. He has prepared good works for us to do. God pronounced everything He created good. He gives us good gifts. He says good trees bear good fruit. And so on.

Personally, if I got to choose the word we were all going to consecrate to use only for describing God, it would be “holy”. I would be totally OK with us losing expressions like “holy cow,” “holy moly,” etc., forever. (And when my kids were little and would use one of those expressions, I would remind them, “Only God is holy.”.) First of all, there are far fewer people and things that could correctly be called “holy” than “awesome” or “good”.

“Only Thou art holy,” we sing. And it’s true. Though Christians are a holy nation, and we’re to strive for holiness, we are only positionally holy and set apart because Christ’s righteousness has been imputed to us. Even our righteous deeds are as filthy rags. In a common grace sense, we might say someone is a “good” man for the job, or a store is having an “awesome” sale, but there is no common grace sense in which anyone but Christians – and we, only through Christ – could, in any way, properly be called holy.

My second question about reserving “awesome,” or any other adjective, strictly for God is: If you’re going to be consistent with your line of reasoning, how far are you going to take this? If you’re going to stop using “awesome” for anything but God, are you also going to stop using the word “good” for anything but God? What about “perfect”? Powerful? Just? Kind? Compassionate? Merciful? Are you going to stop saying, “I love you” to your family because God is love, and only He loves perfectly and completely?

I hope not. I hope you won’t stop using any of those words, because God doesn’t require you to. It would be self-imposed legalism. Remember when Jesus said to the Pharisees, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath.”? He was trying to teach them that the Sabbath was meant to be a blessing and a benefit of rest to God’s people, not a slave driver of legalism adding one more day of work (to earn God’s favor) to their week.

It’s kind of the same general idea with language in this case. Language is one of God’s good and awesome gifts to us. It gives us a way to express our reverence for Him, but also our delight in the work of His hands – like ice cream and dogs. Just as with the Sabbath, there’s a godly and appropriate way to use language, but, outside of those parameters, language was never meant to enslave us or hamstring our ability to communicate. When we use language to appreciate God’s good gifts, or to express delight or pleasure, knowing that every good gift and grace redounds to His glory, He is exalted.

When we use language to appreciate God’s good gifts, or to express delight or pleasure, knowing that every good gift and grace redounds to His glory, He is exalted.
Tweet

If you’re convicted not to use the word “awesome” for anything but God, or you don’t want people calling you awesome as a matter of conscience, that’s totally fine. Don’t violate your conscience. But you must realize that it is a matter of your conscience, not everybody’s. And you can’t bind others to your conscience. Whether or not to use the word “awesome” is an issue of Christian liberty. It is not a biblical command.

Listen in to Christian Liberty on A Word Fitly Spoken

Mailbag

The Mailbag: How can I grow to love Jesus more?

April 25, 2022April 25, 2022 Michelle Lesley

Originally published June 11, 2018

I have been a born again Christian for many of years. But how do I get so in love with him?? Please can you help me.

This could possibly be my favorite Mailbag question ever. How can I love Jesus more? What a sweet and precious thought. I should be asking that question every day. We all should.

The first thing you will have to determine in your own heart, through prayer and study of the Word, is exactly what you mean by your question. Do you mean:

“I’m a Christian, but I consistently have no affection for Christ whatsoever. I just don’t really care about Him one way or the other, but I see other Christians who seem to genuinely love Him. How can I get those feelings for Jesus?”

or:

“I’m a Christian. I love Christ, but I want to develop an even greater love for Him. How do I do that?”.

If your meaning is closer to the first question, I would counsel you to examine yourself to see if you are truly saved as 2 Corinthians 13:5 instructs us. Someone who has genuinely been born again should have some sort of affinity, love, gratitude, and affection for Christ because of who He is and all He has done for her. If you honestly don’t give a flip about Jesus, that’s a big red flag signaling that you might not be saved, even if you think you are. I would strongly recommend working through my Bible study Am I Really Saved? A First John Check Up as well as setting up an appointment with your pastor, a trusted, spiritually mature Christian friend, or a biblical counselor for counseling.

If you’ve compared your heart and life to Scripture and you’re certain you’re a genuinely regenerated Christian who wants to grow in the love she already has for Jesus, it’s simple. Just do what His Word says:

Study Your Bible

I would urge you to put away all of the “canned” studies (books, DVDs, etc. written by others) and simply pick up your Bible, choose a book, start at the beginning, and work your way through to the end. I cannot stress enough how much more rewarding studying the Bible for yourself is than relying on someone else’s materials, and how much closer it will draw you to Christ. If you’ve never studied the Bible on your own before, try taking notes on the text, or use one of my studies (see the “Bible Studies” tab at the top of this page) as “training wheels” to get started. Here are a few other resources that may help:

Bible Study Articles and Resources

10 Simple Steps to Plain Vanilla Bible Study

Rightly Dividing: 12 Do’s and Don’ts for Effective Bible Study

You’re Not as Dumb as You Think You Are: Five Reasons to Put Down that Devotional and Pick Up the Actual Bible

Pray

You can’t grow in your love for Someone you’re not spending time with. Set aside a designated, uninterrupted time of prayer each day in which you can take all the time you need to pour out your heart to God, worship Him, praise Him, and thank Him. But talk to the Lord throughout the day, too. “Lord, I have to discipline my child right now. Help me do it in a godly way.” “Father, thank you that these peaches I needed were on special today!” “I see Julie coming toward my office. Lord, she’s so hard to love. Please help me show her Your kindness.”

Resources on Prayer

Basic Training: 8 Things You Need to Know about Prayer

Sweet Hour of Prayer: Learning to Pray from the People of Scripture (a 12 lesson Bible study on prayer)

After this Manner, Therefore Pray

Can We Talk?

Be a Faithful Church Member

Find a doctrinally sound church that preaches and teaches the Bible well. Become a member. Faithfully attend worship service and Sunday School (aka: small group, Bible study, etc.) each week unless an emergency comes up. Find a place to serve, and get plugged in. Make friends with other members of your church and spend time in fellowship with them outside of church activities. Being fed the Word, serving the Body of Christ, and bonding with brothers and sisters in Christ will build your love for Him.

Basic Training: 7 Reasons Church is Not Optional and Non-Negotiable for Christians

All Word and No Play: The Importance of Fun and Fellowship in the Doctrinally Sound Church

Preach the Gospel to Yourself

Remind yourself of what Jesus did for you – the sin He saved you out of, the forgiveness, cleansing, and peace He freely gave you, the power the indwelling Holy Spirit gives you to resist sin and walk in holiness, the home in Heaven He has promised you.

For while we were still weak, at the right time Christ died for the ungodly. For one will scarcely die for a righteous person—though perhaps for a good person one would dare even to die— but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God. For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life. More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.
Romans 5:6-11

That’s what Jesus did for you. You. How could you not love Him more and more every time you think about that?

What Must I Do to Be Saved?

Be Thankful

Make it a habit to thank God for things throughout the day, especially the things you often take for granted. Can you read? Do you have enough food to eat and clean water to drink? Do you own a Bible in your native language? Do you have a car? Clothes to wear? Family and friends? Air conditioning? Chocolate?

Everything good in your life, every blessing you experience, comes to you straight from the hand of God. Think about what you really deserve for your sin and rebellion against God. Then think about the fact that He not only sacrificed His precious Son for you, but that He continues to bless you abundantly. Every thing you thank God for is just another reason to love Him more deeply.

Top 10 Bible Verses on Giving Thanks

25 Things I Forgot to Thank God For

Give it Time and Be Patient

My husband and I have been married for over 25 years. Everything I feel about him – my love, trust, respect, admiration, everything – has grown deeper since the day I married him. But it has taken years of walking through “for better or for worse, for richer or for poorer, in sickness and in health” together to get to where I am in my love for him today. And if God blesses us with more years together, my love for my husband will continue to grow beyond where it is today.

It’s the same way with your love for Christ. Developing a deep, mature love for Him doesn’t happen overnight. It takes time. There are going to be “for better” days and “for worse” days, but if you continue walking with Him – studying His Word, praying, investing your life in the church, remembering all He has done for you, and being thankful – over the years, your love for Christ will continue to grow and grow.

Complementarianism, Mailbag, Worship

The Mailbag: Women “Worship Leaders” and Confusing Ecclesiology

March 28, 2022March 28, 2022 Michelle Lesley

I have read on previous pages about your response to female worship leaders, and reading your article Women Preaching: It’s Not a Secondary Doctrinal Issue prompted a few questions from me. Our church is now allowing women to lead worship from the stage. The official music director is male. Women will now be allowed to fill the role of band leader on a rotating basis on Sundays (along with a few males). They will pick songs for their Sunday set that must be approved by the music director and elders. It is being put forth to us as not being a problem because the preaching elder is the actual “worship leader” and that this is no different than women leading a few songs in a worship set. And that it doesn’t violate authority because she can’t “teach in an authoritative way.” And we have an upcoming discussion with the elders because we believe this violates the authority aspect of 1 Timothy 2:12. Can you weigh in? Are we wrong in this? Also, is this a sin issue or a secondary issue?

I’m so sorry this has become a dilemma in your church. I know things like this can be distressing when you love your church and are concerned about its fidelity to Scripture.

I’m really sorry, but I am thoroughly confused by what it is that these women are actually doing with regard to leading the music portion of the worship service, and who is in charge of, or leading, what. And I suspect this confusion points to a deeper issue. So let me just offer a few general thoughts and principles.

Part of the confusion here (at least on my part) is the term “worship leader”. It’s too generic and interpreted in so many different ways by different people.

I understand what your pastor (preaching elder) is saying when he says that he is the “worship leader” because I’ve heard other pastors say this as something of a pushback against the idea that “worship” equals “singing,” when, really, all of the worship service (preaching, prayer, singing, etc.) is worship.

So he’s saying he’s the “worship leader” because the buck stops with him on all elements of the worship service, and he’s leading the worship service. I don’t disagree with that, but the terminology is confusing, and this concept muddies the water when it comes to biblical ecclesiology and to questions like yours. It is not biblical for a woman to serve as this kind of “worship leader” because the biblical terminology for this position is “pastor” or “elder” and Scripture prohibits women from being pastors and elders.

Then you have people who use the term “worship leader” to mean “minister of music” or “music pastor” – the pastor who oversees and puts together the music portion of the worship service and directs the choir, instruments, and congregation during the worship service. It is not biblical for a woman (or a biblically unqualified man) to serve as this kind of “worship leader” because this is a pastoral/elder position of leadership in the church, and Scripture prohibits women (and unqualified men) from being pastors and elders.

Finally, there are people who use the term “worship leader” to mean anyone on the platform who’s directing, singing, or playing an instrument. People in the choir or on the praise team are “worship leaders”, the pianist and drummer are “worship leaders”, etc. With the exception of filling the position of minister of music, it is biblical for women to be this kind of “worship leader” – singing and playing instruments under the leadership of the minister of music. The problem here is the word “leader”. These women are not leading, they are being led by the minister of music.

So the term “worship leader” is already confusing. Now we’ve got women “leading worship from the stage,” “official music director,” “band leader,” and women “leading a few songs in a worship set”. Please understand, dear reader, that I’m not faulting or criticizing you for using any of this terminology – I completely understand that you were only trying to be clear. But it’s still all very confusing to me, because it seems to be a confusing model for worship.

When you say women are “leading worship from the stage” and “leading a few songs in a worship set,” I don’t know if that means they are stepping up and acting as if they’re the minister of music, or if they’re simply on the platform singing under the direction of the minister of music, or if they’re singing a solo during one of the songs. Are “official music director” and “band leader” the same thing or two different positions? Is this person only conducting the musicians on the platform or the entire congregation? When you say that songs must be approved by the “music director and elders” does this mean the person in charge of the music portion of the worship service is not an elder (even though this is a pastoral position)?

My point here is that if I’m confused, and you’re unclear on whether or not women should be doing whatever it is they’re doing, musically, before and during the worship service, there are probably a lot of people in your church who are also confused and unclear.

I suspect that most, if not all, of this confusion could be cleared up if your church had a solid ecclesiology regarding the pastoral/elder position of minister of music. Because, right now, what should be one pastor/elder in the position of minister of music, who should be overseeing and leading all of the things you mentioned, sounds like a chaotic revolving door of a multitude of people (most of whom, I doubt are biblically qualified as pastors/elders). I’m guessing the foundational problem here is not what the women are or aren’t doing, but that you don’t have a pastor/elder in the position of minister of music.

Also at issue is that it sounds like your church is following what I call a “concert” model of worship rather than a “congregational” model of worship. There’s nothing wrong with Christian bands and concerts per se, but that is extra-curricular worshiptainment, not a model for the church’s worship service. The music portion of the worship service is not to be led by a “band” performing a “concert,” and the people in their “audience” can sing along if they want to, and happen to know the words and melody, and can follow all the bridges and ad libbing.

The music portion of the worship service is where the pastor/elder of music shepherds, leads, and instructs the congregation in skillfully and worshipfully praising and exalting God together as a body and building one another up through the Word in song:

…be filled with the Spirit, addressing one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody to the Lord with your heart, giving thanks always and for everything to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly, teaching and admonishing one another in all wisdom, singing psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, with thankfulness in your hearts to God.
Ephesians 5:18b-20, Colossians 3:16

The confusion and chaos taking place in your church seems to prove these things out. And remember what the Bible tells us in 1 Corinthians 14, that great chapter on orderly worship:

God is not a God of confusion but of peace.
1 Corinthians 14:33a

Regarding the selection of songs for the worship service: Again, this would not be an issue if you had one pastor/elder as a minister of music. There’s certainly nothing wrong with any church member suggesting a particular song to the minister of music. He can prayerfully consider the suggestion and use it or not as it fits in with his pastoral objective for the music portion of the worship service. But with this “revolving door” leadership model at your church, there’s confusion, and the issue of women planning the worship service arises, when that’s really the job of the pastor/elder minister of music.

To me, the questions of “Is this sin or a secondary issue?” and “Does this violate the authority clause of 1 Timothy 2:12?” as it pertains to your particular church are nearly moot. The main issue is not what the women are doing. The women are like pictures hanging crookedly on the wall of a house that has a crack in the foundation. The issue is not the crooked pictures, but that the foundation needs to be fixed. When the crack in the foundation is fixed, the pictures will hang straight.

How to get started fixing that foundation? I would highly recommend that your elders keep an eye out for the next G3 Worship Workshop and make every effort to attend. And also that they should read everything they can get their hands on by Scott Aniol.

I want to commend you and your husband for meeting with the elders to calmly, biblically, and directly discuss your concerns. That’s exactly what you should be doing and exactly what I recommend church members do in situations like this. Great job!

For anyone who would like to explore the subject more, I have explained in more detail why women should not fill the position of minister of music in my article Rock Your Role FAQs (#16).

Category: Mailbag